what's going on everybody welcome back to another flagship episode of stacking slabs your hobby content alternative here on the stacking slabs network appreciate you taking some time out of your busy day to tune in to listen to a conversation around sports cards collecting sports cards and building out your collection today's episode is your collection your hierarchy we will get into all of it what it means why i'm delivering this episode and everything in between shout out everybody for supporting what we're doing here you can hit the follow button tell a damn friend run on over the patreon group anything you're doing to support the brand is appreciated telling damn friends is maybe the most important getting out there getting at shows spreading the good word posting on the instagram machine doing whatever you can to let people know that you appreciate what we're doing over here because i do appreciate you you know we gotta shout out our flagship sponsor inferno red technology before we jump in they are the engineering team behind some of the biggest names in sports and collectibles like dc sports eighty seven commsi collectors upper deck and ebay from ai powered solutions for startups to full stack platforms for industry leaders their team can tackle your toughest technology challenge they build awesome software for the hobby leagues and fans and for everyone in between see what they can build for you at inferno red dot com we have a brand new episode of build for the hobby coming out tomorrow with scott lock ceo at inferno red technology don't sleep on that so on the heels of the last flagship we talked new releases in collector psychology i do what i've been i wanna do what i've been doing a lot here is try to build can some consistency across episodes and go one level deeper in this episode so we talked about hype the lens was around hype this time the lens is going to be around narrative because i think that if you collect sports cards long enough you eventually realize that almost every hierarchy in this hobby starts as a story before it becomes a standard a card is not born important a parallel is not born more desirable than another a case hit is not born iconic someone tells a story enough people repeat it enough people respond to it and then all of a sudden the thing hardens into a hobby reality so in today's episode i wanna talk about the two kinds of stories that are shaping the way we collect the first is a collector controlled narrative the other narrative comes from or excuse me that is a narrative that comes from us our taste our memory our preferences nostalgia internal logic of the collection we're trying to build the second kind is manufacturer controlled this is narrative or story that comes from brands insert names case hits the premium box configuration athlete tie ins the first game patch programs the award patch programs the language that tells you without directly telling you this is the thing you should care about and just so we're clear from the jump this episode is not anti manufacturer we're not anti tops we're not anti panini we're not anti upper deck it is not anti breaking it is not anti any of the innovation we see in the hobby right now if anything it's opposite opposite of that it's a sign of respect because the brands are doing exactly what good brands are supposed to do they are creating products they are building stories they are trying to make things memorable they are trying to get your attention they are trying to give their products shape and energy and identity and that is their job our job as collectors is much different our job is not to reject stories our job is to understand when a story is helping us clarify our taste and when a story is replacing our taste that's what i wanna dig into this episode the collector controlled collector side because i think the it is the healthiest place for us to begin we do not collect in a vacuum maybe some of us do shout out to you if you are a lone wolf collector who collects in a vacuum who does not get on anything digital or no social apps but you somehow know about stacking slabs and you listen if you collect in a vacuum send me an email i'd love to hear that but we collect we collect because cards mean something to us not abstractly specifically a card can remind you of a year of a player of a moment childhood shop a run of boxes that you ripped with your buddies photo brand surface color design language a part of your life we know that our possessions are tied to identity and collecting is tied to self expression collecting is also tied to structure and control and autonomy matters never forget that people feel better and stay more committed when what they are doing actually feels self directed instead of externally controlled that sounds academic but in the hobby it's incredibly practical because this is why one collector only wants jersey cards jersey number cards or color match this is why another collector wants one rare and scarce parallel instead of ten this is why someone else is obsessed with one era design this is why someone spends years building one specific player run this is why some people love clean base rookie cards and other people could care less about inserts this is why one person wants the canonical card and another person wants the weird one that looks better in hand every one of us has those habits and it all starts with a narrative not a manufactured narrative a collector narrative a story the collector is telling himself or herself about what belongs in the collection and i think the mistake people make in acting like this is somehow less serious than chasing whatever the market or the brand calls important it isn't less serious it's actually more serious because it's harder to fake and it is harder to think independently outside of the distractions that come our way each and every day if you buy a card because a brand tells you it's premium that's super easy i don't care how much money you have to spend on it if you buy a card because social media tells you to chase it that's really easy too there's a lot of influencers in this space there's a lot of content it is easy to buy in if you buy a card because everyone else ranks it first you know what that's easy too what's hard is saying i know what the standard hierarchy says but this is the card i want because this is what fits my in my collection this is what catches my eye this is what elicits emotion this is what should be in my collection those are the collectors who i appreciate and admire and that is exactly why i love the example that pushed me to do this episode so i started digging into something new i started digging into twenty twenty six tops chrome wwe i took a year hiatus i did not collect twenty twenty five although i might be going back looking at some opportunities but the reason why i got so drawn into twenty twenty six was because i thought it looked cool i love the design i love what it captures i'm having fun with this new product which is something i haven't been able to say with a new product outside of colt's prism stuff in a very long time and what i realized is that i'm more drawn to the geometric refractors or geometrics in the delight configuration than i am true refractors not because someone told me they matter not because they are more sacred in some official hobby ranking not because i think they are right for everybody i like them more because they look better to me they hit a different visual nerve they remind me of surfaces and aesthetics i've loved before they feel closer to the finite side of prism or the mosaic style cards that came from an earlier tops era they feel more alive more distinct more like something i would stop and actually admire and that matters and that's a beautiful thing about cards it exposes the lie that there is always one obvious answer topps itself frames breaker's delight as a premium format because it carries exclusive geometric parallels and more autographs in a box but tops own wwe buyback structure does something interesting it does not create some absolute official proclamation that a standard refractor is morally superior to geometric in buyback tiers geometric and standard refractor variants sit in the same general brand same with the numbered versions so even inside a manufacturer's own program the hierarchy is not nearly as rigid as collectors sometimes pretend it is that matters because i think a lot of collectors still carry around the invisible guilt when they prefer something that is not the main card and i think we should kill that guilt if you like the geometric more than the true that is not a failing test that is revealing your tastes and tastes matter if you like the surface more the shape more the rhythm more the visual energy more that is not irrational it's the whole point aesthetic preference is a valid collecting reason actually let me go stronger than that for an actual collector aesthetic preference is not just a valid reason it might be the most honest reason because this is not about money this is not about investment this is about proving this is not about proving you're smarter than the market this is about spending your own money on cards actually feel right in your collection and if a collector can't can't explain why a card belongs in the collection beyond people say it's important that is not conviction that's borrowed taste and who wants to borrow taste man ceos of rpc we make the decisions we call the shots for most of us we can't make we don't have the final say in most of what we do in our personal and professional life especially if we have busy careers and especially if we have a family with a lot of kids collector controlled narratives are not automatically healthy just because they come from collectors collectors can build their own dogma communities do this all the time instagram does group chats do hobby podcasts do probably guilty of this forums did it before that everyone says a certain parallel is sleepy everyone says and one insert is underrated everyone says one card is better than another that can still become herd behavior so i'm not romanticizing collector narratives as pure i'm saying that the goal is self authored taste you can hear the room study the room learn from the room but do not let the room become your collection now the manufacturer controlled side let's look on the other side because this is where the environment gets really interesting manufacturers are not just making cards anymore they're designing meaning they are naming the chase they are choosing which card gets placed in which format they are deciding what gets called premium iconic ultra rare historic innovative case hits and everything in between and every one of those words that they use matter because language teaches hierarchy panini is very open about this in their own copy color blast get framed as peak chase kaboom as long has long been framed as big branded event card tops does it too delight is the premium format gold shield cards are framed as artifacts tied to achievement this is just taking a step back and looking at in what are they saying the words on the box matter the words on the sell sheets matter this is why kaboom is such an important example historically kaboom taught the hobby that a heavy stylized insert could still be the card people see talk about and remember first panini's own historical coverage of the kaboom as one per case comic book inspired and supported by a cult following later there was a most maybe the most important point of it all is that kaboom became the key chase wherever it lived despite not lean leaning on old formats or autograph it didn't matter what product it came from it was positioned in a way that it was the chase that shouldn't matter to every collector because it means hierarchy in the modern hobby is not inherited from history it can be installed there are a lot of installations in flight and a lot of installations being planned and we should all just be aware of that a company can teach the hobby what matters a company can mend a new category a company can take a card concept and turn it into a noun people chase regardless of the product that is what happened with kaboom this is what happened with color blast and that is what we're watching versions happen right now in real time look at the topps current playbook patch programs tied to the first game and award seasons those are powerful because the story is instant first game first patch one of one award winner real achievement real artifact that is easy to communicate and easy to remember the official copy literally leans into the language of significance and artifacts you have inserts like kaiju that are built to be visually loud and instantly brandable not random loud designed loud the player is not just pictured the player is a myth mythology in a way the city is not just implied it's worked into the visual story that is manufactured control narrative doing exactly what it's supposed to do turning a card into a mini world you have athlete access and promotional architecture on top of it pull a tom brady auto at card vault by tom brady and you're literally we'll get a facetime from brady think about what that does that card is no longer just a card that pulls now an event the event becomes content the content becomes social proof the social proof becomes more demand that is an accidental that is a designed feedback loop and on top of all of that you have a broader license control and athlete control fanatics collectibles is not just dropping random products into the market it is building an ecosystem across major league baseball the nfl nba wwe rights direct partnerships with players exclusive athlete roster global activations direct shop relations and live platforms in the company's own language this is about innovation storytelling premium design and creating a broader collector experience so if you are asking how manufacturer controlled narratives will shape future card hierarchies i think the answer is by making the hierarchy bigger than the cardboard itself the future hierarchy is not just going to be best rookie card or best autograph it's going to be tied to first moment it's going to be tied to official achievement the insert brand and trap the insert brand that travels across sports the premium box exclusive surface the card attached to an exclusive athlete relationship the pull that turns into a story a clip an event an activation that is where this is headed and from the brand perspective makes perfect sense a name chase simplifies a giant checklist a case hit insert creates a headline for a break an exclusive parallel justifies a premium box format cross sport insert franchise compounds brand equity a first moment relic turns novelty into mythology celebrity tie ins expand reach beyond hardcore collectors again this is not me trying to be cynical this is me saying the playbook is coherent and because it's coherent collectors need to be more coherent too what this means for listeners it means a lot and we should consider that so what do we do with all of this if the goal is not to be negative not to rage at brands and not to complain about the environment but to become more aware i think the move is to build personal hierarchy on purpose not in your head in some vague way actually on purpose actually with language with standards with rules you need to know what your collection rewards if you do not define that the environment will define it for you and the environment right now is extremely good at defining importance for you so i think the collector filter needs to sound something like before i buy a car i wanna know do i like this card or do i like the narratives around this card if nobody posts the card for a month would i still want it does this card fit my visual thesis of my collection does this card connect to why i collect the player the brand the sport or the era am i buying a card or reacting to a script and maybe the hardest question of all if i strip the hierarchy that the brand breaker or community assigned to this card would it still earned its place with me that's the test because once you do that a lot of noise dies immediately and this is where i think we can start to hear and see something more clearly it's completely okay if your hierarchy doesn't match the hobby's hierarchy if you like the geometric like me more than the true refractor own that if you don't cool if you prefer a certain surface own it if you care more about the image than the serial number own that too if you want cards that look incredible together in a box on a wall or in a case own that if your collection is aesthetic first own that that is not lesser collecting that is collecting with an actual opinion and opinions are fantastic in this hobby not thinking like everybody else is a good thing and i think that's what gets lost when a manufacturer story and a community story get too loud at the same time collectors start acting like their preference has to be defended in market terms and it doesn't sometimes your reason can simply be the card looks unbelievable it fits in my collection and i wanna see it every time i open up my cards that's enough now i also don't wanna ignore the role of breaks in social content and all of this because it matters breakers lower the entry point for a lot of people creates community for some it lets people access products they would never been able to buy and i think that's real but livestream converse commerce is also pretty clear that social presence environmental cues scarcity cues and the general structure of live streaming ex environments can stimulate impulse buying it's undeniable so the lesson is not don't have fun the lesson is know what kind of room you're in before making decisions a break room is not a neutral room a hot release is not a neutral moment a case hit clip is not a neutral input a celebrity titan promotion is not a neutral signal those are all narrative accelerants which means that the collector who wants to stay grounded has to be willing to slow down when the room speeds up that is where the edge is not being louder than the story not pretending the story does not work just being conscious enough to ask whether the story belongs in your collection or not so if i had to land this whole thing in one spot i think i'd do it here narratives aren't the enemy the story is strategy narratives are a part of the hobby collectors tell stories with their collections manufacturers tell stories with their products communities tell stories with their preferences breakers tell stories with their rooms social media tell stories with clips the problem is not that the stories exist the problem is when a collector forgets that they are stories because then a suggestion becomes a command a chase becomes an obligation a hierarchy becomes a rule and you start building a collection that makes sense to everyone but you and that's the trap and that is what i want you to hear from this episode you don't need to hate the process to become more aware of the process you don't need to reject ultramodern cards to think more clearly about modern cards you don't need to fight the hobby to stop outsourcing your taste you just need to know what your collection value so the next time someone tells you a card is the most important the grail the premium chase the one you own i think the right response is not blind agreement and not cynical dismissal either it is a better question who told me that why are they telling me that why do i actually believe it for my collection if the answer is yes great buy it enjoy it celebrate it show it off if the answer is no keep moving because i think in the long run the best are not the one that obeyed the loudest hierarchy they're the ones that revealed the clearest point of view and that's where i'll leave it today build your own hierarchy trust your own eye let the hobby suggest don't let it decide thank you so much for supporting stacking slabs your hobby content alternative shout out inferno red technology for sponsoring the flagship episode of stacking slabs shout out you the loyal listener of the stacking slabs podcast do me a favor hit follow hit that five stars tell a damn friend we'll be back next week with another one take care talk to you soon