Alright. It is finally here, the week of the national. This is, being brought to you, twenty four hours before the national commences.

Really excited to dig into another episode of the staging area with Tory, from DC Sports eighty seven team. Tory, mad dash. I know. You've you've preplanned everything.

Everything's in order. Everything's gonna get to Rosemont, Illinois like it needs to be. No worrying. None of that. How are you feeling as we are kinda in this final stretch going into the biggest show of the year?

Yeah. Yeah. Excited. Super excited. You know, I think for for us, it's a lot of planning and logistics and all that leading up to a few weeks before.

And right now, it's just like the, you know, Christmas Eve night. It's like, alright. Let's just go to sleep and wake up and get there. So, no.

We're super excited. It's so much fun every year. See all our customers, put some names to faces. That's not how you say it. Faces to names. You know what I was going for. Yeah. And just and just everything goes on on the show floor.

You know, it's it's so cool that we see, like, all the big players from, like, business, the manufacturers, the grading companies, the people we work with, the customers who send us cards, athletes walking around, people dropping off.

So, yeah, like, there's not a boring second while we're there. So, yeah, I guess, like you said, as this releases, it is the day before. So we are getting set up and super excited to see everybody rolling in here tomorrow.

We're gonna have fun, mostly be a a conversation about, national prep. We'll talk about some players and cards, and then just are some storylines that we'll be following, going into the show and following post show.

Tori, I before I forget, I just wanna make sure, you get a chance to tell listeners, where where is DC Sports, setup gonna be?

Maybe point listeners in that direction if they wanna come by and say, hey. Yeah. Sure. So we are in the corporate area.

So this will be our, I think, fourth year of being set up in the corporate area. There's kinda two of them set up in Chicago this year, so we are not up in the corner that's like Fanatics and Topps. We're kinda down.

So when you come in through the main lobby off to the right, there's a corporate area that we're gonna be over there near, Comp Sea and not too far from SGC and a handful of others. So, we've got a nice big booth this year.

We've got 200 square feet more than we have in years past. So little more room to mingle, interact with people. And as I think I mentioned before, we're gonna do a lot of same day listing at the show.

So we're bringing some extra people from the team to help out with that. You know, we're doing any card $50 and up, rough value, and then any card that comes from any, national exclusive thing.

So the, you know, panini top, silver, gold packs, black boxes, anything you break there, from those kind of products, we'll list same day. So we'll have a crew in the back handle on that stuff.

But, yeah, we'll be there. It's Booth Number 2120 for so for those with the interactive maps who are kinda using that to guide them around the show floor, that's the easiest way to track us down.

So I have been kind of absorbed with my own approach to the national and, like, what I'll be doing.

And then also, you know, toggling over to my own collecting and how I wanna prep. And, you know, a lot of listeners are going through this right now where they're deciding, like, what do we wanna do?

What is my goal? What cards do I wanna bring? It's this, like, debate back and forth. Just making sure we're prepared, maybe not over engineering it, but it's a mad dash.

So Yeah. Since there's a lot of people out there going to the show, a lot of collectors trying to figure out kind of their game plan, wanted to maybe open up with that.

Like, since this is twenty four hours before, the show starts, maybe what are your thoughts just in terms of either yourself, what you've heard from others, planning prep, what has worked well, heading into the show in the past from a maybe buy, sell, trade perspective for the national show goer?

Yeah. Yeah. I will say, I think the the broader sentiment is you're never gonna regret being a little over prepared, but you're going to regret not being prepared.

So, I think that means a lot of things. You know, we could probably talk for two hours about prep for walking the show floor, but, you know, a couple of big ones that come to mind are, like, know what you're there to buy.

So if you're there trying to acquire something, you've got a big PC card in mind, there's a certain category of card you wanna buy, know what that is and know what they're worth.

I know we love to be reliant on technology these days and you see everybody at dealer booths with their phones out trying to comp like mad.

As we know, those of us who have been to the National before, sometimes the WiFi is not the greatest. Sometimes there's a little competition for cell signal. So know what you're willing to pay and know what your cards are worth.

Whether you're selling or buying, that's good for you to do. Know what your budget is, and I'd say have it in cash. You're gonna have the easiest time making deals with people when you have cash.

That is just always the rule. Certainly not an exclusive rule. There's people who are doing Venmo, Cash App, Zelle, PayPal, like know, everything under the sun, money's changing hands all kinds of different ways.

But cash is king and always will be, so best thing to have. And third thing I would say, like, leverage your network.

Like, you know, I think you're probably a perfect example, Brett. I know if somebody's got a a black prism, you know, finite Colts card somewhere and I see it, I'm gonna text you.

So, like, if if you're going to the show and you know other people that are going, let them know what you're looking for. The the show floor is massive, and it can feel kinda daunting to try to cover it all by foot by yourself.

But if you know people, hey. I'm really looking for, you know, a first chrome gold refractor of this guy, or I really want one of ones of the Colts or whatever it is.

Like, let a few people know. You might get some really hot leads from them that say, hey. I was at a dealer table over in this corner by the bathrooms. Like, swing by there. He's got your card.

So you can save yourself a lot of time and stress by just knowing what you're looking for, knowing what you will pay or sell something for, and using people to kinda shrink how big the place can feel and make it not so overwhelming when you're trying to track something down.

I don't know what what you think or what you'd add to that.

Those would be my first few recommendations, especially if you're going in for the first time or you have real specific goals and you don't wanna walk out with a regret of feeling like you didn't accomplish something.

I think those that's all really good feedback. I was just having a conversation with someone right before we jumped on about, cash versus, you know, Venmo, PayPal, and, obviously, you know, cash is always king.

Definitely, if you have a lot of cash, make sure you know where it's at on you at all times. Yeah. That would be just, even with having cards and having cash, it's just you gotta be very responsible.

And if you're someone who's maybe likes to be irresponsible in the evenings, make sure that cash and those cards are in your hotel room because you don't want a horror story of waking up and missing out on, those cards and that money.

That would not make for a fun national, experience. Yeah. Very true. There's a there's a very busy nightlife there. You know, the casino's just a walk away.

There's a trade night every night. There's massive deals going down in hotel lobbies everywhere. So, yeah, you know, enjoy yourself after hours, but be smart about it. And, you know, bring the cash you're willing to spend.

And I I wouldn't suggest, you know, emptying your bank account just to say you have enough cash with you. So, there's a there's a responsible nature to the budgeting that's important too.

This is one final note that I'll add, and it's mostly feedback and me trying to get some understanding. And I've been to the show, but it's always good to get reminders.

I've gotten this a few times, and I figured it's worth saying is that, you know, when you're looking at your cards, you might use a card to, you know, get move into something new or bigger, and it might be a card that you weren't expecting to move.

And I think having like, if you're making decision right before you leave on what stays and what goes, even if it's a card that you think you'd never let go of, but but might have a chance, like, make sure you you bring it, but then you might separate your your stacks of cards.

So, like, when you're showing cards off to someone at a dealer table, like, maybe you don't wanna show off some of the bigger cards, and they're only used for cards of your dreams type scenario.

So I think, like, this feedback on, like, if you're bringing cards, like, have maybe two stacks.

One that, like, you're willing to move anything if it's gonna help you get into something else, and then your other stack is, you know, rare exceptional instances where that card of your dreams there.

And it might be the only card or two or three cards that you'd get rid of a grail that you've held on to forever.

Yeah. For sure. And and you never know when you're gonna get that chance to trade up into something or put it towards a bigger card.

So it doesn't hurt to bring it, but I definitely agree. You've gotta know what you're bringing that you're willing to part with, you know, somewhat casually, but like I said, know the number.

You know, don't go and just empty everything just to get more money in your pocket if it's not worth it to you.

But, yeah, you kinda have to make those distinctions or else you might walk out of there with some buyer's and or seller's remorse that you certainly don't wanna leave the show with because just the the experience of getting to walk around and deal everybody, just some of the cards you'll see, like, that's the other thing I think.

You know, it's more than a go into the show trying to make the experience more than transactional. I think we talked about this a few weeks ago and people always ask us, like, what's your goal?

How many cards you take in? It's like a it's we try to not think of it that way. It's like how many people can we meet for the first time? How many people who we've known forever but not, you know, only see once a year can we talk to?

How many really cool, like, historic, epic memorabilia pieces might you see at some of, like, the auction house exhibits? So, like, just enjoy that stuff.

You know? Certainly go chase things. It's, everything under one roof is amazing, but, yeah. Have a good time while you do it. I wanna hit some, players. Players that I think probably will be showing up at the National.

And what I did, Tory, to get this list is I just dug into card ladder and did players in their indexes that were increasing over the last three months, and just seeing some of the hottest players according to sales volume.

And what I'm gonna do here, I'm just gonna pull up a card, and this will be, during this three month stretch, the highest selling card of the player.

And then, just wanna get your opinion on just, maybe, what you've seen on DC Sports side or just sentiment.

And the first player I have up, who is, over the last three months, up 49% is Aaron Judge. And the card I have is you'll see a theme here with this, by the way, is the 22 tops now. This card sold for 55 k.

I would imagine there'll be a lot of Aaron Judge cards at the convention center in Rosemont, Illinois. Maybe just some perspective on Judge and kinda what you're seeing and maybe expectations with him and his market.

Yeah. You know, Judge is an interesting one because it feels like every year for a couple years now, we're talking about how hot Judge is and how stuff goes up. You know, he's kind of in baseball.

I think the way we've kinda looked at, and we'll probably get to some of these guys, but like the Curry of basketball or the Mahomes of football where it's like they become such these, like, blue chip players in the hobby that they're already at such a high level and then just as they continue to perform, same yeah.

That's what's happening with Judge, incredible season.

You know, the prices just keep climbing. The demand keeps climbing. And even in a market where there's just so much supply, you know, the demand outpaces it and we see amazing sales like these. So I think we'll see a lot of Judge.

You know, he's an interesting one because I think when you look at, like, the card lighter index and we see him way up, you know, I also think we'll see a ton of guys like Kyle Raleigh who are, you know, been playing amazing and and kinda right behind Judge in that AL MVP race.

So, you know, it's just I think everybody's after him, and he's one of those really safe bets where people feel like, hey.

You can buy him, and even if there's a little dip or they're out of the playoffs early, what whatever might end up happening.

Like I said, like those other players in the other sports, it's just so safe, that I think we're gonna see a lot of Judge trading hands.

And I think he's also one of those players because there's so much out there and there's so much available.

Your point earlier about, like, people who may trade up into cards, this is the kind of player I see a lot of that happening at big shows where it's, hey.

I've got a, you know, a 2013 Bowman Chrome, Aaron Judge, First Auto, but I wanna trade up into a refractor. I wanna trade my refractor up into a blue.

And so, because a guy with his insane ceiling following hobby presence, commands such values, I think you see even more of that where people have PC cards they're willing to move because you can just kinda you can climb the ladder at judge prices all day long, and so, you know, there's always somewhere to go.

So I I think we'll see a lot of that be absolutely will be a big presence at the show. One final on Judge is, you know, so much of modern baseball ultra modern baseball conversations around prospecting.

Well, with Judge, like, you've I mean, it is it is established, undeniably that he is one of this air these this era's best players and has a strong collector base with it.

Does does the fact that, like, yes, of course, Judge could always do more and his prices could can continue to go up, but seems like Judge has a pretty solid floor at this point.

Do you think, like, when you're when you're comparing him versus, you know, maybe PCA or somebody else that we've been talking to in the past, like, how different do you think that makes things when you're, you know, at the show trying to buy a card, or does it change anything at all?

Yeah. It definitely matters.

I I think with him, you know, to your point, he's been doing this for long enough that I think it's a matter of with every player, like, if you're buying a player or selling a player, you have to have an awareness of floor and ceiling.

Right? And I think with Judge, you can say, okay. He's in New York, so that doesn't hurt anybody's hobby value. Like, being in the big markets is big. He's on a long term contract, so he's not leaving New York.

We're probably already looking at him. Well, I mean, we are looking at him as a future hall of famer. It's that, you know, well, if he stopped playing today, would he be he still might be.

And so you can kind of project out and say, okay, I can look forward to his Hall of Fame induction. I can wait for the Yankees to be a deep playoff run one of these years.

So there's all these times where I think you can look at a PCA or one of the younger guys or a prospect. And while the ceiling may be astronomical, that floor doesn't have the security the judge has.

And so I think when people deal on those cards, there's a different thing you're looking at where, you know, you're not in as much of a rush to sell, which means maybe the, the price you're willing to sell for is not as negotiable.

You don't think the guy is as volatile, so it's gonna affect the way you buy in or sell out of pieces of his. So, definitely changes kinda how you manage where he sits in your hobby portfolio, because of all those factors.

Like you said, compared to the the prospects and rookies, which are, you know, kind of the lifeblood of the baseball hobby right now, but deal with those wild swings sometimes.

Moving from judge to a guy that, you know, I don't it he's always in this conversation.

Whenever, like, this type of chat is happening, I feel like he's always the guy no one brings up, but is always there. And this is, Steph Curry. Curry's cards are up 44% over the last three months.

Again, like, found this a little ironic that his highest selling card is a tops now card as well with his, autograph gold one of one night night selling for the astronomical, half a million dollars. Curry, you know, four championships.

This card itself and what it represents and his only, Olympic moment, only dream team gold medal moment and the way he did it, like, undeniably is will forever be remembered and is certainly on the shortlist of best players ever in the NBA.

Certainly, the best shooter of all time for my money. Maybe talk a little bit about Curry and just Curry's market and cards.

It seems like it never the it's it seems like it's pretty steady, regularly and just, but we always talk about, you know, LeBron and Jordan, and, it just doesn't seem like Curry kinda gets into that conversation.

But his his market's performing really strong right now. Yeah. Yeah. For sure. And I agree with you. It's a it's a strange one.

Like, we get so caught up as a hobby, a society, a universe in this MJ versus LeBron goat debate, and it's like, in the process, we almost I don't wanna say we forget about Curry because I don't think we do, but, but you're right.

It's like that's where it happens. But similar to LeBron, like you said, four championships, MVPs, what Curry's done, like, there is no reason we ever see his cards decline.

It's just a matter of, is there one more playoff run-in the warriors with the team they've got put together now? You know, how many more years does he play and keep racking up stats? How long till he goes into the hall of fame?

Like, we know all that stuff's coming. So, again, kinda like we said with Judge, all the Curry's been doing this longer, crazy high floor. And it's just that ceiling can just bump up notch after notch when some of those things happen.

But, yeah, it's definitely interesting too seeing the tops nows. You know, it's so interesting to me because I feel like a few years ago, I feel like people looked at tops now like they almost weren't real cards.

It was like, I mean, things are gimmicky, they're overproduced, they release every time something happens.

And it's like as, you know, pop culture and society and big moments have kind of intersected with the hobby more, and I think it's been a big push of fanatics, and just the space in general.

It's it's cool to see the night night moment like this, the, the Judge 62 you say.

You know, we actually just sold a Curry, one of the Panini one and one Timeless Moments autos Or I think it was like 8,000 and look it's an amazing card but it's an auto number to 49 from a tenth year product for him.

And so it's one of those things where it's like it is cool when you see things like that and the moment meeting the the piece of collectible or the card, doing just these insane values.

I I realized that's not half a million, so this one's a bit of a unicorn here. But, yeah, you know, Curry's got a got a following. I I think he's got that, you know, that mark made and the way his game changed the game.

And anytime somebody has a a claim to fame like that, that's just one more feather in the cap that kind of cements their their safety as an investment when it comes to cards.

So we will see no shortage of car curry on the, on the dealer floor for sure here in Chicago.

So, moments matter. That's a that's another theme here, and I I I was I was kinda surprised to see my guy, Tyrese Halliburton at the top of the list. He his market is up over the last three months, 38%.

Probably, a lot of those game winners had to do with it, and this sale, his, you know, some would argue his best card is rookie 20 '20 black prism sold for a 119 k. You know, he's my guy. I'm I'm buying Halliburton Strong right now.

You know, I'm not getting really any deals on it, but when you go and you capture the hearts and minds of, you know, a collector base or fans, like, people want your cards and they wanna hold on to your cards.

I can't imagine, like, he'll be flashy at the national because he's hurt and he's out for a year much like Tatum, but I don't know.

Like, based on you being a spectator and maybe seeing what Halliburton did and then maybe how it ended, like, how do you think all of that influences maybe not only the three month stretch that we're talking about here, but maybe just future values of his cards?

Yeah. I mean, I think we talked about it before. It's like he's clearly taken that step to prove he can be the guy in the moment on the team.

I mean, you know, we saw that all the way up until not all of game seven of the finals, but, you know, the the first part. And so, yeah, I think he's moved up a tier in the hobby.

It it is one of those tricky ones where we look at it and we say he's up 38%. And like you said, trying to break that down and say, how much of his market activity is based on what we saw he was capable of?

How much was based on the run itself? How is that gonna be impacted as we go into the NBA off season? As we go into a season, he won't be playing at least most of.

There's just so many factors with him that, you know, my my suspicion going into the show is we see a lot of stuff displayed of him and maybe much to your chagrin, I think ticketed very high.

I I think we saw what he can do, but nobody wants to rush to sell him on injury pricing.

Nobody wants to rush to sell him on going into a season where he won't be there. So I think we see a lot of if he's a PC guy for you, if he's somebody you're in for the long term, you might see some sticker prices you're willing to pay.

But I think a lot of people are gonna be hesitant to offer the, you know, big deep Achilles discount pricing.

So, you know, we'll we'll have to see what happens. But that that's what I would expect from from somebody like him, and that goes for the other guys.

Same goes for Tatum, same goes for Lillard, same goes for the other NBA stars who have cemented themselves as great players, had good seasons, got hurt, were in the off season now, they're not gonna play most of the next season.

You know, a lot of those same factors exist for each of these guys.

Alright. We're moving over to, Messi, and you can't talk soccer cards without talking Messi. His 2018 Topps Chrome UEFA Superfractor Auto one of one PSA 10 sold for 102,000. I mean, we Tory, we're talking about 6 figure cards here.

I mean, it I think if you're trying to figure out if the market is hot right now, I think a bunch of 6 figure cards right in a row probably tells you something. But his market is up 28%.

I I know in other categories, they have their 10 pole athletes like basketball, you know, Jordan, but, like, I don't know in this era with, like, players that like, the conversation, it seems like, with soccer start and stops with Messi just really dominates that that segment.

And I don't collect in it, but I've talked to enough soccer collectors that if you're collecting soccer, likely, you've got some Messi in your collection.

What do you what do you think about just, like, the performance of Messi cards, and then just expectations for for either Messi or soccer cards coming off of or coming down the road of just kind of the World Cup, happening here soon.

Yeah. I I was gonna mention it until you beat me to it.

The the World Cup is a big part for sure. I mean, it's one of those things you can look at years in advance and start buying cards on the expectation of just knowing that much buzz around the sport helps.

I think Messi is interesting. I don't know if you've seen this. I saw it posted by a bunch of people that like, document page somebody had signed by Babe Ruth from forever ago, and then they got Brady, Messi.

I'm trying to think who else was on there. They were getting all the goats of, like, every sport to sign this thing, and it was just gonna be like this Mount Rushmore piece of paper.

But it was interesting to me. I also kinda like you said, I'm not a huge soccer fan. I don't personally collect soccer. But, you know, modern era, it's like Messi has won, Ronaldo's two, and that's just kind of the guys.

But, yeah, between the World Cup coming up, you know, Messi's achievements and accolades globally is huge. The global popularity of soccer as a sport, the fact that he's now you know, in The US, played in the MLS now.

So we've got kind of, you know, more and more collectors here who maybe weren't tuned in to international soccer that are now on him. So, yeah, I mean, a $100 is is crazy, but, I mean, it's a it's a messy Superfractor auto PSA 10.

I you know, take any sport goat and give those characteristics of the card, you're gonna see a big number. So, yeah, I think it'll be interesting to see, you know, what the soccer presence at the show is like.

But, you know, obviously, it's gonna be headlined by his stuff no matter where you look. Alright. A guy that, the hobby really likes, and this is Anthony Edwards, his twenty twenty National Treasures, RPA out of '99, PSA 10 auto 10.

It's a pop two. This is crazy. Sold for a 132,000 in May. Ant Man, you know, two trips to the Western Conference Finals, two l's, but it doesn't seem to matter.

His cards are up 22% over the last three months. What do you think it is about Anthony Edwards that, has the hobby invested and interested in him? Yeah. I I think a lot of it okay. Performance is big, but I think personality helps.

And, you know, Edwards is one of those guys who, like I'm not basketball is not my number one sport, but when I just kinda watch the way these guys carry themselves, it's like that little bit of MJ and Kobe in him that maybe people say LeBron doesn't have sometimes.

It's that killer instinct. I know I'm the best in the world. I'm gonna go beat you. And so I think on a on a young team as a superstar at only what's he like 23 or something now?

Like he's still so young. I think it's easy to project out a future where like, to your point, hasn't gotten out of the Western Conference finals, but clearly the skills are there.

They seem to be wanting to build around him. And so I think people feel like it's inevitable.

So, even though there's no championships yet, it's like, well, for a guy that young to be doing that much, it's just kind of a a slow and steady climb because year over year, even without winning at all or anything, he's accomplishing more and more and people get behind him.

So I know we see a a ton of his cards coming through and, you know, one of the ways that that I know he's popular is when when these sets come out, right, you think NT, we see the big RPAs.

I mean, this card's crazy, but it's also things like 2024, '25 basketball comes out and it's select or mosaic, and he's one of those guys where just the numbered color sells well.

And when you see the hobby paying attention to even the cards that aren't super exciting and aren't a 100 or a thousand and up, but the really healthy constant demand for the 10 and $20 cards, like that's when you know there's just such a broad demand that it's really healthy for the market.

And so that's what we see with him, which is why I think there's all the reason in the world to have confidence market going forward.

I promise I'm not like, this this is this list isn't rigged outside of moving around some Pokemon characters.

You know, I'm I'm just proud of you that it's Peyton Manning up next and not Anthony Richardson. So, hey. You you know, you made a responsible choice here. Oh, so we've got Manning.

He's up 20% over the last three months. His o six ultimate collection, shield auto one of one sold for 84 k in June. Just a a massive card. You know, I I'm just try I've been in Peyton chats trying to figure this out.

It's like, what do you attribute to the sudden rise in demand in terms of pricing for Manning? Do you think it's just the inventory of high end Manning cards hitting the market, something else? Like, what are your thoughts?

Yeah. I mean, the the two things that come to mind with me with Manning are are, one, so many of like, this is from o six. And I you know, personal opinion, I've been collecting forever. You know, I'm almost 40 now.

So when I look back at the mid two thousands, early two thousands, like some of these game used cards that came out, there's just something more like raw and cool about them because there's so many fewer than there are in today's market.

So I think there's just over time as people acquire some of these, the supply dries up. I I realize Manning still has autos and relics and stuff coming out in moderns, you know, ultra modern sets.

But particularly this older stuff, I think it just continues to appreciate because there's not more of it, and they're hard to track down.

I also think with Manning, you know, just little things like Peyton and Eli's show they do and stuff like that.

Like I think people just he's in front of your face a lot. He's a very marketed guy even after his playing career ended. He's still very involved in the sport.

You see him all the time. He's doing interviews. He's hosting shows. He's on podcasts. So you take the amazing career he had. You take the maintained relevance he had. And then you take the limited supply of cards like this.

I think it's just a formula for a guy with a great career to to be maybe more lasting and have more of a steady climb than we might see with, you know, others from his era, not named Tom.

Hey. What also probably helped out this card a little bit, Super Bowl winning year on, 02/2006, so that definitely doesn't hurt. Yep. Final guy I wanna talk about who's up 16% is Josh Allen.

His gold kaboom sold in May, May 23 for 44 k. What I love about him being on the list is that there is this contingent in the hobby who has just not given up on Josh Allen, MVP year last year.

And I'm not sure there's a player. You could debate Lamar Jackson, but there's not a player, I don't think, that, fans outside of Bills fans wanna see, you know, have that mountaintop moment, more than Josh Allen.

And I think that maybe impacts some of his pricing. So football's always popular at the national. Like, what do you see, or what's your perspective on what's going on with Josh Allen's cards right now?

Yeah. I I think it's what you just said. I mean, we're we're going into you know, we're almost to August. You know, training camp and football season is just around the corner.

We all know he's capable of it. He just hasn't done it yet. And I think every year there's so many people who say, this could be the year, so I'm buying. I know he's expensive, but to me, that's just the reason.

Nobody's debating that he's a great quarterback. Maybe we're debating whether the Bills are gonna get it done or not, but there's enough people saying they are that it feels like every year it's the same way.

I agree it's not dissimilar to Lamar Jackson, but I think he's more of a case here. I think Jackson's maybe a little more polarizing in the hobby.

The number of people for and against are buying or not, but yeah, you know, everyone wants to see Josh Allen do it and who knows if we do this year, but I know that we see a lot of his cards come in and starting in a couple weeks here as we really get close to the season, I know we will see a ton because he's just one of those, you know, he's not nearly the end of his career yet.

We're on what year seven or eight, and everybody's still in in love with him and hobby and otherwise.

So, you know, prices just keep climbing and it seems like even when they don't quite make it, we see, like, this momentary dip in the off season because they didn't get there, and then roll right back around to a new season starting and prices start to rise again.

So, not not surprised to see them on this list. Maybe final and it's just on the card itself, the kaboom. Obviously, like, there's a lot of conversation about kaboom, and just there being a lot of kaboom's.

An easy way to to kinda limit that is, you know, buy a gold kaboom, even though they're really expensive. And this one is a rookie gold kaboom.

So, like, when you're trying to protect yourself on the kaboom market, like, how important do you think those, like, scarcity variable and, like, first appearance or rookie variable in terms of, like, a card, you know, maybe holding, like a kaboom, which is super popular holding long term value.

Yeah. I mean, if you're that worried about, you know, the the supply and the market being flooded, just buy the green and move on, and nobody's gonna do anything to you.

Like, you know, real easy. But no, seriously, I don't I don't feel like the kaboom market is gonna drop because of them being overproduced. Maybe, but it's just one of those things where it's like we haven't really seen it happen yet.

And it's kabooms, it's downtowns, it's, you know, the color blasts. I mean, all these short printed inserts just seem to catch on and catch fire so much.

And once they get put in that list of like what's the card to own and say in football we start rattling them off and we say okay well there's the NTRPA, there's the Prism Silvers and Prism Color.

And it's like not far behind that we go right to kabooms in downtowns, almost irrespective of year. Like if it's got a big guy's name on it and it says kaboom, that's a great card. And so I think there's just so much demand now.

You know, we've got a few customers that can sign with us that are sending twenty, forty, 60 kabooms in downtowns a weekend, and I've kinda just watched it to give, like, myself the anecdotal feedback. Okay. What's happening?

Like, do they seem like they're dipping? And they just don't. Even, like, where we see seasonality play in with certain sports where there's less demand for them, people keep selling the kamooms and they keep doing just as well.

So, I think if someone has that concern, I can understand saying, okay.

You're gonna chase PSA tens because there's a lower pop. You're gonna chase golds because they're numbered. So, I get the angle, but I think at some point, like, you're probably just as good off owning multiple.

You know, how many regular kabooms could you all own for one gold? And, you know, you get into some some really deep pocket math here really quick. But, yeah, you know, I I don't think kabooms are going anywhere.

I don't think the supply is gonna drop, and I don't think the price is gonna drop even, you know, knowing that. Awesome. That was fun digging into some maybe of the most popular players heading into the national.

Wanna move over to kind of our hobby intel segment, and maybe we'll do a little bit of a pregame show for the national, and I I just there's a I was thinking about what's happening in the hobby and just topics and everything else, and felt like there's a lot to talk about.

So let's let's start here. And I'll tell you what, Tory, man.

I've been just coming off the Halliburton injury. I've just been so beat up, like, not being able to watch Caitlin Clark. And I know I know, like, they're doing the right thing now, just making sure she has time.

But it's been interesting. Right? She the all star game was here in Indianapolis, which was awesome. It was the city was decorated, and she was a big part of it.

Although, she didn't play and, you know, she's still out. So they're being patient. Well, her cards are still very much a part of the conversation, seeing them on IG, seeing collectors talk about them. We've talked about rookie royalty.

Yeah. How do you like, when you think about Caitlin Clark, and it being really, like, the first big, like, in Chicago, Caitlin Clark, the hobby hype is really strong year. Like, what are your expectations for her cards at the show?

Yeah. So it's funny. When you were just kinda introducing this topic, it was kinda weird you talk about, you know, they're doing the right thing, they gotta be careful with her.

I'm like, I swear I heard this out of the New Orleans Pelicans, like, six or seven years ago. But Don't don't do this to me. No. No. No. But no. I I think she's gonna be everywhere.

I mean, I think the WNBA market has obviously exploded and it's on the back of Caitlin Clark cards. I'm curious to see you know, I said it earlier with Halliburton, like, I expect a lot of high sticker prices that maybe don't get met.

I'm curious if the same happens with Caitlin Clark because the products have just like, if you're getting a WNBA products, you're spending a lot to do it. I mean, we talked about rookie royalty, but even all the other products.

Like, this stuff is not cheap. She's obviously the foundation it's built on and that's the big draw. And it's gonna be interesting how her market moves as there continue to be more and more products put out.

I think so far the demand has kept up with it, but you do start to wonder at a certain point, and I know we're gonna talk about WEMBI some too. I have some of the same thoughts there.

Like at some point, do we just start introducing so much that it suppresses it some. And we'll see, maybe she's just such a monumental figure in the sport and in the hobby that she can outlast that.

But, you know, I think we'll have to see. I think they're gonna be in all the showcases because if you bought royalty, you probably want to get some of that capital back.

Her cards are still selling really well and so I think people are looking for it too. Now whether they pay the prices or not, you've got to have draws at your table.

Sometimes cards are at tables not just to sell them right in the moment, but to get people to start conversations with you as a dealer, to strike up trade talks. What are you buying? You know, what do you have to sell?

So, she'll be everywhere. No no doubt there. I think the the best question is your next one, and I'm curious what you think before I answer on, are people gonna price and try to deal these long term or short term vision?

Like, what's the what's the Clark market gonna tell people to do?

You know, it's interesting. So it'll have been out by the time this goes live, and I'll I'll point everyone. If you haven't listened to it already, check out the WNBA card podcast, on the stacking slabs feed.

I I dug into some data and some performance data regarding, you know, thousand dollar cards sold during a three month stretch year over year.

And what we're and I I took Caitlin Clark out of the dataset because, you know, it blows everything up. Right.

Even without Clark in the dataset, much to what you said earlier, the WNBA card market performance be probably because of Caitlin Clark, a big reason, is it's it's this year is performing so much stronger than it was in previous years by volume of sales, dollar value sales, which is good.

It's like what you wanna see if you're buying WNBA cards.

Now if we're focusing in on Clark, I would I would imagine there are a lot of people who got into rookie royalty, and they're gonna wanna get out of rookie royalty because the prices are so high right now.

So what I'm curious on is, what their markup is based on what my perception is of what they paid for it.

And I think this is a show where a lot of dealers probably got really excited and figured, you know, I can make a lot of money, but then a lot of these cards are be are showing up and showing out.

And there's only so many, you know, $60,000 rookie royalty cards of Clark that can actually sell. So I say all that to say, if you want one of these higher end cards, which I would say, like, maybe go look at some of the other stuff.

But if you want some of the stuff out of rookie royalty, like, you as a buyer might have an advantage because my assumption is dealers are probably trying to get out of this stuff in Rosemont.

Yeah. I agree 100%. I think you're gonna see a lot of sticker shock when you walk up to tables, but I think those prices are gonna be negotiable.

And I think there are people who wanna get out of those cards. But if you really wanna own one, I think don't rush. I I I think no matter how she performs, like, just looking at these prices, it's hard to imagine them going up.

Let's say she comes back healthy, she kills it, her market stays on fire. I think, like, staying exactly where they are is kind of the ceiling, and so I don't think you need to rush to throw a ton of money at these.

Alright. Let's talk about Wendy, which when I was putting this together, I was like, we gotta talk about Wendy.

But what's weird is it feels like for as, for as much as we were talking about Wendy, and I know he was hurt, and I know we're seeing video clips in the off season, this and that, but it it just feels like, the air got let out of the tires a little bit.

I'm gonna say this, which anyone listening to this, it might sound shocking, but I purchased a Wendy card last night, my very first Wendy card.

But I saw a card, and it hit all these profiles for me, and the price was really nice that I hit buy it now. And I'm excited about it. Do you like, what do you think about the National and Wimby?

Like, do you think seeing all those cards and the conversations around his cards? I'm sure many dealers, but especially high end dealers will have some sort of windy card in their case.

Like, what what do you what is your expectation for for his cards, at this show? Yeah. For sure. I mean, they're gonna be everywhere, but I think that's in part because there are so many of them.

I I mean, I think we saw with, you know, the 2023, '24 basketball class, it was a little bit like the Caitlin Clark situation where it was like one guy was so heavy in that rookie year that he kinda carried that class, And they just kept releasing product after product after product.

And, you know, with some of the ways these schedules are now, like, we didn't get NT basketball until, what was it, like, January, February of this year?

And so that's for the twenty twenty three, twenty four class. So Eighteen months after his career started his rookie year, we've still got sets coming out from his rookie year. I think there's just so much supply.

I don't think the buzz in terms of you open a pack or a box of that stuff and there's just like this huge payday if you hit Wembley. I don't think that comes back. But I do think the Spurs are built in a really good way.

You know, you look at that team and Darren Fox was a great ad. You got Castle there. You've got Wembe. You've got all the moves they've made. Like, they're built young and they're built strong, and I don't see them going anywhere.

So barring crazy injury or something like that, I think the hobby as a whole views WEMB's career and the team context he's in in still on a upward trajectory.

And so I think for that reason, we're seeing the maybe the ceiling has dropped. I don't think it recovers back quite to where it was, but I think just as much as that has happened or more, the floor has raised.

And as long as it's not drastic injury, I think there's gonna be a ton of demand for him, a ton of people looking for him at the show.

And as we, you know, kinda get up on football season here and then not too long after we see basketball rolling around, you know, we've already had the draft and other things.

Like, there's a lot of factors that can drive momentum his way. So, I think a lot of a lot of them be changing hands in Chicago this week.

I tend to agree with you there, Tory. Let's talk about football, young, rookie, second year quarterbacks. I would imagine there's going to be a lot of buzz around Jaden Daniels.

He seems like he's going to be the top guy at the show, based on his track record last year. I think it is also gonna be interesting to see. I know they're they're your squad. I'm I'm curious with the harder schedule.

You're you're to a film if anything changes. I'll just say this. Like, I've said this before to other friends, but, you know, he went to my high school. So I'm just like, hey, Washington. Pay Terry, man. You're you need Terry.

You you need Terry to be with Daniels. You need it. Like, so I'm interested to see how that, all shakes out. But, yeah, what what like, talk about Daniels. I know you're a fan, but what are your expectations with with him and his cards?

And then anybody else, like, if there's a maybe a sleeper or somebody else no one's talking about, like, what's your what's your take? Yeah. I I definitely I I will say before we skip by it, like, please pay, Terry.

Like and it's it's one that I was talking to a to a friend the other day who's done a lot of work with the the commanders and, like, Terry's never it was so weird to me to see when the news came out about some of his comments saying, like, this has been really frustrating.

We've really gotta get a deal done. I thought we'd be further along because he just never struck me as the kind of guy to say those things.

He's just this team guy who goes out every week. And so when he's saying that, it's like, he's done enough for the franchise. Please, man.

But anyway, we're not talking about the wide receivers. We're talking about QBs. I definitely think Daniels is guy number one in terms of the high end cards, who people are chasing after, what dealers are gonna have a lot of.

Obviously, year one, you know, look at the playoff run, look at what he did in the regular season, he stayed healthy, like there's really there's just so much promise there.

Added some weapons with Deebo coming in and hopefully, you know, just seeing him continue another year of development.

There's a lot of names we're seeing a ton of right now. So Daniels is one. I'll say the other name I'm seeing a ton of coming in is Justin Herbert.

Now kinda feel like he's one of those guys where it's almost like we talked about Josh Allen, maybe not quite the same where it's like you keep hoping for a little more and you don't quite get it, but you get the gawny stat lines.

So let's see what happens with him. And I will say overall, as far as, like, sleepers, it it's kinda weird how we look at guys.

We're so urgent and immediate and right now, and we love rookies, that like one of the guys that came to mind as a sleeper was Bryce Young. And it's like, he got drafted two years ago.

Like this is not, it's not like he's been around for five years and we forgot about him. But looked really good last year. We've seen a lot of people buying on him, so I think he's one people are gonna be looking for a lot of.

And then I also think more of the sophomore guys from last year, I'm I'm hesitant to call them sleepers because, like, if you go buy into a break or you open a box and you get one of these guys, you're thrilled.

But the Drake Mays and Bo Nicks and Spencer Rattlers, like, some of these second year QBs who are in situations where people think they can do well, who showed a lot of promise in the past.

They've got the the tools and the skills, and they've kinda got hobby recognition from being one of the guys in the QB class, but then kinda had Daniels run away with it. And after that, we were kinda after Caleb Williams.

And Knicks was probably creeping in there, you know, too, but I think those other sophomore guys, there's gonna be a lot of eyes on, a ton of demand for it to show to try to get in before we get to the early weeks of the season and a couple of them play well, and we see prices, you know, kinda hockey stick up.

I I think that's a fair assessment. We talked about you know, we were talking about Curry and Manning, and we talked about goats a little bit.

So I in the interest of time, I just kinda wanna keep rolling, and I wanna hit maybe the business side of the national, and I'm I'm super curious on you from your perspective, you know, being an operator of, of a of a growing company in the space and just trying to get your perspective on, like, obviously, fanatics is gonna play a huge role at this show.

Grading companies are gonna play a huge role at your show.

There's going to be new start ups, new shiny things, new activations. Like, you're gonna be setting up, like, how do you absorb kind of what what else is happening around you from in the business ecosystem?

And, like, maybe what are some of your expectations on on what some companies will be doing in the space?

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's you know, you've got everybody in one place, and that's why they do it. So, you know, I know we see a promotion from everybody.

We do consignment promotions. You see the graders with specials. You see the manufacturers like Tops doing the wrapper redemptions where you buy some cases and you get some rewards packs and things like that.

So there's always something, and I think in today's world of social media, we're all broadcasting that stuff so much. If you're going to the show, you kinda have to make yourself a list of, I wanna go try to get this here.

I wanna see this happen. I wanna be a part of this event. So, that stuff's all exciting. But it really just is, directionally, like, all about overlapping experience with the cards at the National.

I think if you look at the Nationals of old, it was just whatever I wanna buy, it's there because it's every dealer in the world under one roof and I can buy it.

But, you know, we were talking to our our contacts at eBay, they're gonna be doing some free brake promotions.

We're up on the main stage breaking high end product and all you have to do is, like, go to one of us who can sign through eBay. There's a QR code you can scan and it gets you an entry to win a spot and a high end brake.

You see the grading specials people do. You know fanatics getting athletes out there and really just pushing like the marketing of overlapping culture with collectibles and making it exciting.

You know we see it like Fanatics Fest these athletes going up and buying cards at tables and seeing the content from those transactions and things happening.

And at the same time all the things that they may announce around innovations and products and new things they're debuting and things like that.

So it's, you know, it's kind of one of those where it's almost hard to project what it's gonna be.

It's just kind of the message is if you're there, you're gonna hear about it because there's just so much going on, that everybody's trying to market everything.

And at the same time, I would say though, if you're going to the show, like, any booth or setup or thing you don't know about, it's worth thirty seconds to check it out.

Like, you know, I think sometimes we get so, these preconceived notions of like I want grading, I gotta find PSA.

I want, you know, I wanna see product, I gotta find tops. It's fair. I get why. Good example. So last year we saw a company set up called Haystack.

I had no clue who or what Haystack was. Haystack had a, their own imaging device, like a proprietary imaging device and then software that did card recognition to help generate titles more efficiently.

We started talking to them within ninety days of the show, we started working with them.

We've been working with them for the last year and they've been a huge help to us. So like there's a lot of business to business, same as there's like business to consumer or customer stuff happening at the show.

And I think even if you're not in the card business, like check some of these booths out, see what they're offering, see what's new and what's out there.

You never know when you may wanna make it a side business of your own or start a little side hustle or it'll, you know, weekends, after hours, nights and weekends thing you're doing in cards and see what people are offering.

There's there's just so much you can learn about the way the companies are interacting with each other, with customers, how you can use it to improve your collection.

How can you find cards you want faster? How can you understand the value of your cards better? How can you list your cards better? Where to sell your cards? So, you know, don't discount anything because you haven't heard of it.

Go in there and realize the big players are gonna give you big news, but there's also a lot of newer entrants and that's where they're gonna be and you really get a cool introduction to them when it's a lot more personal than than it might be with some of the bigger, you know, groups and organizations out there.

I'm gonna be spending, a half a day, if not one of an entire day, just going around corporate and trying to have conversations with as many of people as possible, relationship side of the hobby, like, this is the best place to do it.

Yeah. And you also get, you know and we experience this every year.

Like, when you interact with us through our website, you may have a question. Hey. Where do I send my cards? Thanks for reaching out. We send you the address. Let us know if you have questions and it kinda ends.

Like, take advantage of the fact, like you just said, you can walk up to these corporate areas at these corporate booths and just ask questions, like, conversationally on a personal level.

You know, it's it's really interesting, you know, some of the angles. Like, I think there's a lot of people in the space who maybe don't understand VeeFriends as like a card concept.

Go to Gary's booth and ask him. Like, he's gonna be standing right there. You know, if you don't understand why we at DC Sports 87 list cards that auction on eBay a certain way, walk up and ask me. We'll talk about it.

Like, just, you know, don't be shy just because you're in a corporate area. Like, go ask people like they're just another collector because 90% of them are and they'll be more than happy to have the conversation with you.

That's phenomenal feedback. I I would imagine you you expect there to be a lot of content going on in the hobby. I'm or at the national, I'll be participating in a lot of content.

Like, what We've seen content, you know, I'm thinking about my first national in Rosemont, and there was cameras there, but it just seems like content in the hobby has taken on a a life of its own.

And I'm a I'm I'm someone who who who's living that each and every day. Maybe talk about, like, content at the hobby and, like, what are your expectations?

What do you what do you forecast? Yeah. It's interesting because, what what was the first national you attended? Like, do you remember what year it was? I think it was 2021.

Okay. Okay. So I've been for longer than that, but I think mine was, like, 2016 or '17. So it goes back a little bit, but I remember back to then. And you would see people like, that was when we were taking pictures at booths.

Like, hey. Look at this cool car, so I can text my friend. Now I look out from our booth and like you look at the walkways down the show and it's like you see so many people. It's like boom mic, camera, ring light.

Like these guys are set up for, like, production quality content, just walking the aisles of the show. But it's cool. It it means the end product we get on Instagram and TikTok and everybody's streams is is higher quality.

And so, people are filming everything. Like it used to be you filmed the athletes or the bright shiny object at the show or the big announcement.

Now you film every single interaction and then people leave and cut that up and edit that to provide you the most relevant, interesting, meaningful content for you to consume when they actually publish it.

So it definitely plays a huge role. It also, because there's so much content, people aren't strangers as much as they used to be.

You know, I know just from like you and I doing this, we're gonna see somebody at the show who's gonna walk up and know our faces because they've watched this who I've never met before.

It's a cool icebreaker because a lot of us have seen each other in Instagram reels and Facebook posts and TikTok videos and all this stuff.

And so, I think that gives you more of a sense of community baked in already going into the show that is really good at kind of stoking the fire of interaction once you're at the show.

So, I think that dynamic helps a lot. Even though there are a lot of people who have probably never published a piece of content maybe around collectibles.

But it is definitely way more polished than it's been in the past. Alright. Let's round out this conversation by maybe talking about postnational ripple effects really quick. I know a big part of the DCU ripple effects really quick.

I know a big part of the DC sports operation is in those final moments of the show waiting for, individuals who might not have sold some cards to come over to you and and submit those cards for for you all to list on eBay.

You've been a part of and I've always left before Sunday. I've always had to head home. So I don't know.

Like, I feel like at the the the the final hours of the show, there's a lot of story lines and a lot of things that maybe you can uncover, whether it's, like, what players were talked about the most, or how many cards you're getting, and what you're seeing.

Like, what are your expectations maybe in the final hours of the show, and then post national on just maybe different things or trends that you might we might be seeing in the hobby.

Yeah. Sure. So I will say we as consignors see a huge dump at the end of the show. Now the end of the show, if you've ever been there for the very end, that, like, 1PM to 4PM window on Sunday, it is dead.

People are getting on planes to go home. People are getting their cars to hang out. But pretty much every year, the biggest cards we take in are in the last hour of the show.

And what that usually is, it's dealers we work with or it's private collectors who had the card on them all week. Maybe they got it back from grading PSA day one. Maybe they brought it with them to the show.

Maybe they got it in a break during the show. And they've been walking the floor trying to trade up into another car, trying to sell it for the price they want. And if that doesn't happen, there's your cash is king rule.

They just wanna get instant sale, make it happen. If that doesn't happen, and I'm sure this goes for all consignors, they come see us at the end and say, hey, tried to move this car this week, didn't have any luck.

I'd love to sell it for you guys. What can we do? And sometimes that's, hey. Can you guys take it back for you and list it on this day to end next Sunday night?

Because I feel like that's when things will pick back up post show and Sunday's great on eBay. Sometimes it's just, hey, I wanted to move it in person but it didn't happen so I know I can trust you guys with it, drop it off.

A lot of it is dealers. It's dealers who've been buying collections all week or collectors who brought you mentioned that pile of here's the stuff I wanna sell.

Say you bring a 100 cards, you've got 80 left, you don't wanna take them home and set them on the corner of your desk again and not know when you'll sell them, so they get dropped off with us.

So, from our lens in particular, it's super busy the last hour or so of the show. But I would say market wide, honestly, I think the show ends, it's back to business as usual.

It's back to eBay gets flooded with auctions and it's more a matter of people acting on the player trends that they picked up on at the show than it is any kind of price pullback, price skyrocketing, ups and downs, volatile market.

I think it's just people learn at the show, they get money from the show, and then we're right back to what we do every other day where we're dealing on every platform under the sun online to chase the cards we want, the cards we're excited by, and the cards we wanna collect.

Final one for me, and I think this is a fun topic, and you have to have a experience, with this.

But I hear a lot of there are people post national who maybe don't wanna list their cards right away because, you know, everyone has spent their money on the national.

I've always viewed it as, like, stuff is always moving, and to me, it doesn't necessarily matter.

I think right now, it's undeniable. We're all buying, selling, and trading in a market that's very, very strong. What is your, opinion on that?

Like, I know there'll be auctions closing on Sunday night at the National, and I'm assuming they'll still be people buying cards. But, like, should that be a fear of anyone out there who's needs to move cards after the National?

Like, I should wait on this? What's your opinion? Yeah. So my opinion is no. But my opinion is also you do what you feel is right for you.

So, you know, people have asked me this question before and I'll always tell them the the hobby is so big now. You know, even all of us being at the show, do you know how many of us are still on eBay with safe searches, with alerts?

I bet you have a black Prism Colts card hits eBay, you're getting notified in a safe search, and you're gonna bid that night.

Like, it doesn't stop us just because we're out of town. Like, whether I'm at the office, my house, or in Chicago, I've got my phone, it's a card I need, I'm probably gonna find out.

So that's factor number one. Number two, not everybody in the hobby is at the show. A ton of people are there for a day or two. There are people who buy and sell online that don't go to the show that are still bidding on eBay.

The market is still gonna set what the price should be. So I don't think that worry is there. But as I said, if you're not comfortable, don't list your cards on eBay. Don't send them to us right before the show.

Wait till a week or two after. We respect everybody having an opinion on what they think is best, and I'd rather you sell it when you're comfortable selling it than sell it and have this panic and fear and paranoia of it underselling.

But, you know, I can tell you as a as a place that's already sold, you know, coming up on 2,000,000 cards this year, when big things happen, holidays, big shows, Fanatics Fest, the National, the Super Bowl, like, there are certain days we avoid, but this isn't one of them.

And I think the market will stay strong right through it and continue right after it without any kind of blips.

Everyone enjoy your national experience whether you'll be there or following from afar. If you're gonna be there, definitely stop by DC Sports eighty seven and say hi to Tory.

Tory, I'm excited to see you out there in the wild. It's gonna be a crazy week, but, I think, you know, after this conversation, I'm even more ready for it. Absolutely. Me too. Super excited to see you and everyone there.

And, yeah. Like I said, we have twenty one twenty. Come find us, talk to us. We're handing out free t shirts, working signing, we're chatting, we're enjoying the show. So can't wait to see everyone.