Alright. We are back with episode two of The Staging Area. Appreciate everyone tuning in for episode one. I am excited to dig into today's agenda with Tory at DC Sports eighty seven.

We're gonna be talking a lot about football and football cards. I know with basketball season ending, and we're gonna kinda put that on a I don't wanna go there now.

Maybe at a later date, but with that with basketball ending, we'll look forward into football and just the planning and organizing around it. No. I want to your question.

I'm gonna interrupt you because I have to know. When you saw the Achilles go, how immediate was, like, the sadness of this game is over? Or as a fan, how long did you let yourself hold on to the hope of maybe we can pull this out?

I'll take the question, Tory. You know, it was a feeling like I've never felt watching a game. You have Halliburton who went three for four from three in the first five minutes of the game.

When when he sent the third three through the net the net, my wife was in getting something out of the refrigerator, and I yelled, did you see that?

Oh my god. He's on one. We're gonna win this. You know what? 40 epic performance to win the finals.

Exactly. Right? Because that's the way the story was going. And then he goes down, and before the replay, which ESPN showed way too many times, I never need to see that again. You just knew by his expression that it wasn't good.

And and oddly enough, when he was playing through and there was all this debate, my biggest fear as a fan, because we had seen it so often with especially Lillard in this playoffs and then Tatum, and then I can't I couldn't help but thinking about Durant and his injury and Achilles injury in the finals.

That was my biggest fear. And then it happened. And to say, like, the air got sucked out of my house would would be an understatement. So immediate sadness, came in for me, and I I couldn't watch that game.

Right? The probably the it was the biggest Pacers game ever as a fan for me, and I couldn't watch the game, without just feeling sadness. And I've talked texted, talked to other Pacers friends, and they certainly felt the same way.

It felt we felt distracted. I'll say this, though. We were up at halftime, and there was a sense of, man, this sucks, but we still got a real shot to win this.

Yeah. And then the third quarter happened, and you just could tell we did the the team wasn't mentally there, and you Obi Toppin said, I I wasn't mentally there.

So really hard to overcome. I'll say this, like, congratulations, OKC. Your fans, your team, incredible team.

SGA certainly earned some brownie points for me going into the locker room after the game, after the confetti fell, and getting a moment checking on Halliburton. So it's been a tough pill to swallow.

Haven't really had a chance to publicly talk about it, so I'll take I took the question. That's how I'm feeling. It's sad, but at some point, I'll go back and and and look at the season and, remember all the good times.

But I'll say this, card related. I have been more inclined to dig in and explore my Pacers cards and collection and set up to save searches around players like Halliburton because it's like a coping mechanism for me.

It's like, I got over the luck thing when I first started going harder at collecting him, and I'm finding similar things with Halliburton.

So that's what I'm going through now. Nice. Nice. Alright. That's fair. No. I think I don't think you're alone either. I think a lot of people, you get a scary injury like that, and it is sad because it's like, look at the Celtics too.

It's like all of a sudden you're hearing, there goes Porzingis getting traded and you hear about Jaylen Brown getting moved and start blowing these teams up.

But I think when guys get hurt, they get bought. It's it's weird. The market tells you they're gonna dip, and the prices do dip.

But you've got the investors saying I can buy them low, and you get the fans saying, but I can still buy them. I'm gonna do it while they're down. So, yeah, there's a, you know, we gotta find a silver lining.

You had a really fun team to watch take an overwhelming favorite thunder to seven, and you get to buy their cards a little cheaper now. So, hey, take take the wins where you can go.

I'm I'm gonna try and maybe a question back at you on this is, you know, the one piece of feedback I have heard, and I haven't been paying close attention because I don't really need to hear all the commentary.

But it just seems like, some of the narrative right now is just like the Halliburton went from that stupid athletic pull of most overrated by 14 members of the league, and that narrative just, like, took over to now it's like he went out and played, put everything on the line, had this miraculous, you know, playoff run.

And now it seems it's hard for me because I'm I'm always in it, and I I always see him as an amazing player.

But it seems like the rest of, like, basketball fans, collectors might view Halliburton at a different light now even though he's hurt.

May like, maybe do you see, like, that sort of thing just when a player maybe changes his trajectory, whether it's through a gutty performance or through a, game winning moment?

Do you see, like, shift in collectability of a player happen, and maybe what does that kinda look like on your end?

Yeah. Yeah. No. It does for sure. I I think it's just you know, especially in a sport like basketball where it's so superstar heavy. Right?

Like, you look at basketball and the roster sizes compared to even, like, baseball, but much less football or others are so small, and it's just carried by these superstars. I think a guy like Halliburton, when you kinda get that, okay.

You got drafted, you know, four or five years ago. You've been good, but you haven't done what we expected. You've changed teams. Like, there's so many knocks that get you got overrated Paul you talked about.

Like, it's so many knocks against a guy that when you come out and you lead your team, who wasn't even supposed to be in the finals to game seven, you've got gritty performances.

You've got making big shots. Like, it definitely adds up to where I think there's almost like a ceiling there for it's like a you've earned good in this league, but you haven't earned superstar.

And I'm not saying he's quite cracked into, like, that elite elite status yet, but he's at least, I think, opened up that door where he could move into that level.

And so it'll be really interesting to see what happens now because it's okay. Now he's got the rehab and the recovery, and then when he comes back and see how things go.

But, wish he wouldn't have gotten hurt. But certainly, I think he he earned a lot of respect from the league and in doing so from fans and collectors, everybody else. So, I think it opens up a lot for him in the future.

Absolutely. Distance makes the heart grow fonder as they say. Let's get into I thought it'd be, interesting to maybe dig into just that what has sold in an interesting car that has sold, at DC Sports eighty seven this week.

And I'm gonna share it up on the screen for everyone watching in the Patreon, but maybe let's get into what is a card that sold at DC Sports eighty seven that might be fun to talk about. Yeah.

For sure. So I think we're talking about the Pete Crow Armstrong, orange refractor auto. So we sold this just this week. It's raw, and this is his first chrome auto. So this is, you know, the card for any major leaguer, for $8,100.

Now to put that in context of what a good season can do for a guy, I'll I'll let you take a shot at this, Brett. One of these sold in early April, an SGC nine five ten. What do you think that one did? Okay. So I I cheated a little bit.

I didn't see I didn't see I didn't see that sale, though. I saw another raw copy. I I saw another raw copy sell in April for, 1,600. So which So this was at this were very April. It sold for a thousand bucks.

Oh my god. $9. 05 10. So and and I think this card's interesting for a couple of reasons. No. Number one, just performance leads to price. Like, that's kind of a given. It's, you know, kept an obvious statement.

But, I mean, Pico Armstrong was good last year. You know, so drafted by the Mets in 2020. This card's from 2020 Bowman draft. But then obviously gets traded to the Cubs, debuted in 2023. First full year was last year.

And last year, he was in. He's amazing defensively, but that doesn't translate to hobby value. We all know that. It's kinda like, you know, defensive players in football. You know, you gotta be on the offensive side of the ball.

You know, centers and primary defensive guys in basketball don't carry the same value. But, you know, now this year, all of a sudden, we're in June. He's already twenty twenty, you know, homers and steals.

And so he has just turned it on offensively and his card prices have gone through the roof. Helps that he's on a good Cubs team. You know, being in a good market on a team performing well is a big part of it.

But, it's just interesting because so often with prospects and we know that prospecting kinda drives the baseball world these days when it comes to collecting.

But it's like you kinda get your shot. Right? You get called up, and it's how you do a debut, and people are waiting. And it's you might go over four or three strikeouts, and you might lose 20% of your value overnight.

Are you homered in your first game? I think it was, Jason Dominguez homered in his first game off Verlander last year, and, you know, prices just go to astronomical places right away.

And so with Crow Armstrong, it's interesting because he came up and he was good, but nothing exciting to set the world on fire.

You go to this year. We know he's gonna be a starter for the Cubs. He's playing well. But, like, to say in April, an orange first thought was a thousand bucks.

Now here we are eight x ninety days later. It's just a testament to what to what can happen and how, you know, I think a lot of us who are trying to be on the conservative, smart, sharp angle of cards would say, hey.

When they get called up, that's your time to sell. It's a guaranteed bump. You know you're gonna profit. Don't hold. Well, hey. Every now and then, you know, people get paid for holding.

So, you know, good for them. Awesome to see him playing so well. And especially in a year like this where we're kind of on a relatively lower end rookie class, it's really cool seeing guys like him take off.

He was a rookie last year, but having this year be, like, the big coming out party along with Jacob Wilson and some other guys. So, yeah, just a a really exciting sale. Hey. Good for the owner. Congrats.

But, yeah, cool to see how his market has moved. So I'll just some some stuff I looked up before we started recording, rookie last year, twenty twenty four, a 123 games, batted two thirty seven, 10 home runs, 27 stolen bases, 47 RBIs.

This season in 79 games, batting two seventy two, 21 homers, 24 stolen bases, 61 RBIs.

First cub to have two six RBI games in one month since 1920, and is the fourth fastest major leaguer in the modern era to record 15 home runs and 20 stolen bases in just 60 games.

So those are the types that upward trajectory is what the hobby loves, what the hobby wants to see.

I I would love to maybe just dig into, like, the Cubs of it all. Obviously, Cubs have a massive fan base, lot of Cubs collectors out there.

Do you think that a card like this where, PCA is in a obviously, his first card in a Mets uniform, do you think that that card maybe has a is not as desirable to a Cubs fan, or do you think it it it matters at all just because it's his first card even though he's in maybe opposition an opposition uniform?

Right. Right. Yeah. I I think it matters. I don't know how much it matters. You know, and I think it's interesting. I we talked about this last time. We talked about SGA drafted by the Clippers and Halliburton drafted by the Kings.

And it's almost like you look at a lot of these players now. You got Tatisa's first pro mono is a White Sox, and now he's on the Padres and So to, a national who went to the Padres, now the the Yankees and the Mets.

I think there are certain things that kind of transcend that where do I think it matters?

Yes. I'm an I'm an Orioles fan. Right? So, if I had my choice of any card, it's gonna be like that first chrome auto with a color match orange refractor.

It's just ideal. But I think the first Chrome is so desirable for players that I think that's just the card to have. Everybody knows it. It's not really a question, and so I think that kind of overcomes everything else.

And I think especially in a case like his because you can if you're a collector, you've got options. Right? So I could go after this first Chromosomet, or I could go for his 2024 stuff where it's rookie card logo in a Cubs uniform.

And so if anything, I think what it kind of can do is if it's a player like that who's drafted early enough, I think and Tatis is another example of this where 02/2019, he's Padres uniform rookie cards.

Pro Armstrong 2024 uniform, Cubs uniform rookie cards. I think maybe people chase the rookies a little more because it's their main team's cards.

But at the end of the day, I just don't think in baseball, a whole lot can really threaten the value of a, the desirability of a of a first chrome.

Final one on this card that I'd love to dig into with you. Obviously, timing is everything when you're selling, especially cards like this.

The what do you see in terms of, like, availability of the Bowman Chrome first kind of rainbow? Obviously, this is an orange, which there's 25 copies. There's that's not a lot, but there's rare and scarcer, parallels.

This one sold for $8,100, which is is wild. What do you see when a player like this is beginning to pop off? And, obviously, anyone who has a card like this is who's not a fan likely or a collector of the player likely will sell it.

Do you do you see any, like, price discrepancies based on maybe this orange being the first to market, and then maybe a lower parallel coming to market later? Will that for sure be higher than this orange?

Anything interesting just over time you've noticed when it comes to just different parallels coming, to market, that are Bowman Chrome first? Yeah. A lot of it depends on how much people buy into the player or the hype, of course.

I mean, that's kind of an obvious statement. But I think what we see is when, like, you know, PCA started taking off this year, and when the stuff started to rise, what you see early is you'll start to see some people reach.

So, you know, we don't do a whole lot of fixed price listings, but if you look at, like, buy it now is on eBay, you'll start to see some people reach above comps, which obviously doesn't happen that often.

You know, a lot of times we wanna live and die by comps and say, I'll pay the comp and not a penny more, and usually people hunt for less.

But I think what we start to see is they seize on the way up, and maybe there's an auction or a fixed price that there hasn't sold.

And it might reach a little above what they wanted to pay just because you know they're not gonna surface that much, especially when it comes to true colors.

Right? We know that, you know, people treat waves and shimmers and x fractures as a little bit gimmicky, and so the most desirable are the OG true colors, the red, orange, gold, blue refractor.

That's what we live by. I think on those, there's such a desire for them. Maybe even blues. I mean, at the size of the market today, 150 copies is not that much.

And so I think when somebody starts taking off like he has this year, we certainly see a spike in auctions where what we're listing is going up, up, up, up, and we we know to expect that.

But, you kinda get a weird middle two where some people just wanna rush to sell them, put them on auction because they know they're gonna do great.

They know they're into them for way less, so they're just gonna take that margin and run.

And they've got other people who are more patient and maybe they really believe it. And so if they're sitting on one of these right now, they might say, hey. This hit 8,000.

I think he's gonna go 44. You know, the Cubs are going to the playoffs this year. I'm gonna list it at 14,000 or best offer and just see how bad somebody wants one because I don't know if another one will show up anytime soon.

And so, you know, just kind of what you're into the card for, where you're at, how do you value the card over money, are you holding it long term, or do you wanna flip it short term?

There's there's all those angles that exist with any card we're gonna talk about, but, I think those are some of the things we think about with a guy like this. Fun card to kick things off with.

We talked, the National, and that was on your mind last week. Going into the I guess, this or not last week, two weeks ago, what what's top of mind for you? What's the number one thing you're working on or thinking about right now?

Yeah. So, really, I mean, you you alluded to it a little bit earlier, but just seasonality right now. You know, we're kind of at that time of year where there's a lot of things going up and down.

And so, it's really what's the next month gonna look like for us. The national plays into that, but, you know, we just had the Stanley Cup finals wrap up. We just had the NBA finals wrap up.

We're in the middle of the baseball season. We're starting to see prospect call ups, different rookies take off, teams do well or do poorly. Football training camp, not not that far away. You know, we're coming up on football.

I know we're gonna dive into that soon. And so, it's just that time of year in the national in a month where, you know, who's selling to have capital spend there? Who's holding because they wanna deal their cards while they're there?

And so for us, you know, I don't have a a concrete, hard dollars and cents numbers answer for you, but I think definitely for the next couple weeks to a month, it's what are we gonna see? You know?

What are people pulling the trigger on selling football yet, or are they waiting? Are people trying to get that last, you know, bit of basketball and hockey sold now, or are they sitting on it now until the next season rolls around?

How is the market gonna react over the kind of midterm to the injuries to Lillard, Tatum, Halliburton, guys like that?

So there's just so much going on. It's really what's how's that gonna influence what we see volume wise, you know, and also price wise, you know, over the next thirty days or so.

With with the national being such a key piece of the hobby calendar and kind of all roads leading to the national, In this build up, I feel like we're in the we're right in prime time build up.

We're, you know, we're close. We're getting there. It's not right around the corner next week, but we've got a little bit of time. How do you evaluate what's happening from a a buying or selling perspective?

Like, I guess what I'm trying to say is, like, do you start to see things with, I guess, intake and what's coming in or prices and what things are selling for to give you some sort of pulse on, like, what's happening through DC Sports eighty seven that's likely, a result of what's going to be happening in, you know, a month or so at the National?

Yeah. A little bit. I wouldn't say in price as much. I think, there are just so many people buying and selling cards, but we we both know how the hubby's taken off, you know, even post COVID bubble and all that.

Like, there's just so many new people in that, each card that sells, I don't see a ton happening, but it's really about what we get and how much.

The the big trend for us is really if I put our customers into two two groups, and I said one is just your average everyday collector, gets into breaks, opens some wax themselves, buys and sells singles on the side for a hobby, and then the other is your business guy.

Like, he's flipping singles for a living, owns a card shop, breaker, that kind of stuff. The former is gonna be doing a lot more with us right now because it's often all about, alright.

I gotta get cash for the national. Like, I wanna go there with just a fat stack in my pocket, just burning a hole and go find that PC card or just have some fun, break my friends, whatever.

The latter, the business guys, we see a lot less from right now because it's, hey.

If I got a thousand cards that are gonna go in my $5 value box, and I know I can get a lot of cash sales from people walking by the show, I'm gonna make some bulk deals with people, things like that.

They tend to send in not quite as much, and then those are the same people that I'm gonna see last day of the show, Sunday afternoon, saying, hey.

Here's the 3,000 cards we didn't move these this week. You guys can take them home with you list on eBay for us.

And so, it's just kind of the position you're in and the hobby is really what affects that. So our our volume dips a little bit right before the show just because we've got a little less intake from the big, big guys.

But it's not too much. It stays fairly even because we're getting so much more from the people who are trying to, you know, get themselves prepped financially to be there, in Chicago.

That makes a ton of sense. Wanna move over. We did this last time and wanna highlight again the most, watch card or interesting card that you're observing right now.

You sent me this before we started hitting record, and instantly, I was like, this is a great stage setter for the rest of our conversation on football cards, and I think this is an interesting card based on just, so many different dynamics.

And so the card that's listed is the 2024 Topps Cosmic Chrome Bo Nix planetary pursuit SP Ares rookie PSA 10.

At the time of recording, this has six bids for $455. This card, obviously, there's a there's a whole can of worms we can open up that I'm sure we can get into some interesting topics about it.

But maybe when you see this card and seeing what it's doing right now and all the interests, like, what's going on in your head? Yeah.

So there there's a lot here. And it's an interesting card to me because, like, I could sit here and pro calm the card all day long, and it's it's like it makes it interesting to do. So I can go, okay. Let's get the ugly out of the way.

It's unlicensed football. I feel like people just hate on unlicensed all day long. Now I think Cosmic Chrome for football was a phenomenal product this year. I think they did a great job with it. So I really like it.

I think one of the nice things is you're not relying on hits all the time. So a lot of it is about SPs and inserts and parallels. And I think the biggest chase for SPs is planetary pursuit. We've seen it in baseball for a few years now.

Now it's been introduced to football. The interesting thing with this one is with planetary pursuit, for any who don't know, you start with the sun and you work your way out through the solar system.

And as you go out, the cards get rarer. So, you know, you can call them case hits.

The sun is hard to hit. They're good cards. They're chase inserts, but they don't do a ton of money. I mean, we're maybe talking, I don't know, for Knicks, we're probably, you know, 60 to $80, something like that.

Maybe it's a $100. Now to be honest, when I first found out about these, which I found out from, Mike Geo, Sports Cards Nonsense Pod, do some stuff with them.

Their breakers, we we do consignments with as well. And I know he's trying to put Paul Brady solar system, I guess, you call it together.

I've got a rainbow of solar system. What do you call it? I didn't know that Eris was a planet. You know, when I was in school, we stopped at Pluto, so I didn't know what Eris was. So turns out this one is one in every 43,708 packs.

Those are the pack odds on an Eris planetary pursuit. And so, this is a Vonex, which is obviously one of the top rookies in the class. It's a PSA 10, so gem mint. Can't beat that. And it's just impossible to hit.

You know, Mike's been trying to put it together, and a Brady hasn't even surfaced yet. We sold in the last couple weeks two others. We sold a Caleb Williams and a Jaden Daniels, both raw, both did around $2,400.

So, you know, for for a time when we're chasing RPAs and first pro models and things, to see non numbered rookie inserts that are just chased because of how short printed they are doing 2,400, and we'll see where this one ends.

I I imagine north of that given the grade, it's pretty exciting.

And I think the other cool thing is, you know, especially as a consignor, we always talk with people about, like, hey. When products come out, sell right away. And 99. 9% of the time, it's true.

The something comes out, and before the market's flooded, things do the most. I think with these, it could be one of those rare cases where we see the opposite. Especially Arris in particular, there's so few of them.

I mean, I didn't do the math, but I'm sure we could figure out on every 44,000 packs how many there are out there. They're gonna dry up. And so it's one of those cases where maybe the first sale right away isn't the best thing.

So I think these could appreciate if you've got people who wanna chase them and they become harder and harder and harder to find. So, just a super cool set. One I think Topps did a fantastic job with even though it's not licensed.

Really excited to see them do it once it becomes licensed in the future and just, you know, we've been talking about Arisys a lot around here as we see the different planets come through, and this is only the third one total that we've seen since the product came out, in addition to the Jaden Daniels and Caleb Williams I mentioned.

So, yeah, just a super cool card and, as you said, the right time of year to start talking about football.

I think what's what's so interesting about this card and what I'd maybe like to learn a little bit more is, like, you you've build and develop these relationships with so many different, you know, breakers or shops who are, you know, getting access to this, ripping it, you know, breaking.

These cards end up in hands.

These cards get sent to you. They get put on eBay. I'd love I'd love just in the short time we've had with some basketball and now football, and obviously, this will change when, Topps gets the license next year.

But has there been any interesting observations you've made on just, like or surprises on the non licensed component of the these first runs of nonlicensed Topscrum basketball and Topscrum football that are interesting to maybe call out?

Yeah. I mean, I think the biggest one, and I would think it's the most obvious, but maybe if somebody's not looking at product enough, it's plus the pictures.

Like, if the guy's not in a jersey that has a logo and a team name on it, you need to hide that the best you can.

And we have seen products come out. I think the first one I saw or or the one maybe the longest ago now, it wasn't that long ago, was when finest basketball came out, and it just looks atrocious.

It is like, I'm gonna hold the basketball and stare at the camera so you can see that on my jersey. It's all been photoshopped off. And, like, it just the product doesn't land right.

And and I think when you look at a lot of the Cosmic Chrome, I think TOPS did a much better job in, the football products. I think Finest and Chrome football were both better. I'm not gonna say they were perfect, but better.

And then Cosmic Chrome did really well. There's ways you can take the elements of the card, the design, the art behind the player, the different parallels you introduce, they can mask that a bit.

It's like, hey. We all know it's not licensed. But how do you still make it where when we look at that, we go, hey.

That's a cool card I wanna own. If I'm gonna buy and flip cards of this player, people are gonna want that one. If I PC this player, I want that one. And I think it just so much is on the manufacturer to do that.

I think it worked here, and they did it really well on some cards. And I think the ones they don't, you can just see, like, the the secondary market with those single sell, like, people respond to that.

And, you know, I was talking to the guys on a on another podcast recently when we were comparing if you go with the products, it was midnight football to midnight basketball.

Now midnight football, I think they did a much better job than they did with basketball.

And in basketball, you could take, like, three of the bigger names that I forget what we sold or released. It was like Bill Walton, Dwayne Wade, and Tracy McGrady or something like that.

And those three cards totaled, like, a $120 for autos. And then in football, photography was better, just looked better to me, and we did a Drew Brees did one twenty by itself.

Now I'm thinking somewhat arbitrary examples. I'm not saying that defines the entire product run, but I think just you have to pay more attention to the look.

Whereas it's like, if we took Bowman Chrome baseball, I feel like he could put just about any picture on there. And as long as there's a little burst in the corner and the color you want, people are gonna be all over it.

And so, you know, just the sensitivity of the market to those things matters a lot more when the licensing's a factor. No doubt. You know, I'm I'm too far deep in the weeds to know that this is this Bo Nix is unlicensed.

But if I wasn't and I just looked at it, I'd be like, I wouldn't I wouldn't even know, just the way the shot is captured and, it it just looks like a a normal card.

So I think that's an important note and interesting how collectors respond. If it's artfully and tactfully done, then sometimes it it doesn't really matter to collectors. They just want the card.

For sure. Alright. Let's move over to kind of the main segment here, and we I alluded to the fact that we're gonna be talking more about football cards. And the topic here is football card submission window is now the time.

And, Tory, I'm sure you've heard this so often, and just every summer pops up when there is this debate. I hear it online. I see it on person. Is it time to buy football cards?

Is it time to sell football cards? And the fortunate thing about kind of this conversation is you're right in the center of a lot of what is happening. So I wanna maybe dig into this topic for the rest of this episode.

I think there's a lot of ground we can cover. We we when you hear, like, sell football in the summer, is is that the move that you think is the right move? What what is the kinda actual intake you were seeing at DC Sports eighty seven?

Does that, like, confirm or deny the narrative that, you know, we should be selling football cards right now? Yeah. So I I think it it varies by player, by position, by their tenure in the league.

Like you said, there's a lot to unpack here. If I try to say it in a very broad sense, I would say, I think yes. It's it's the time to sell, or I think we're getting there.

I I wouldn't say it's the time to sell now. We're at the very June right now. I think we're about thirty to sixty days from the time to sell. I think this is very similar to spring training in baseball, the preseason basketball.

I think it's you wanna sell right as you get to, like, that kickoff weekend. I think your buzz and all the eye shifting of football is what you wanna capitalize on.

Where I think it makes a big difference is I think, I know we were gonna talk about positions and other things, so I'm skipping ahead a little bit here.

But it's like, if you've got a quarterback who's established in the league, it's gonna take a lot for them to move. So, you know, if we're looking to sell Pat Mahomes, I don't think the price is gonna move a ton.

I think as more eyes shift the football, maybe right as we come up on training camp and the, preseason game start, sure. There's probably a bump from where it is right now just because the market's heavy football.

Other than that, it's almost like, you know they're going to playoffs, just wait till they get there. And I think with veteran veteran guys, it's that way.

I think with the younger guys, it's interesting because a lot of it depends on what you expect from them. I think with football, it's interesting because you've only got 17 games in the regular season.

So there's a good case to be made for really do your homework here. If, if you've got a guy who's a younger quarterback whose market's already moving up a little bit and they're playing a cake defense in week one, maybe you wait.

And if he throw it with three fifty and three touchdowns, maybe you sell right away.

Because in football, when you've got seventeen weeks, you basically got 17 moments that the market's gonna jump up or down. And, you know, every week can respond to that stuff. So that's kind of the way I think you have to look at it.

The thing I think is the most interesting is actually on the lower end of the market. So we're gonna see a steady intake climb from now all the way through the end of the year because it's gonna be leading up to football starting.

What I think is most interesting is the guys who are gonna play in the preseason because it might be the only time they play.

And so every year, the biggest trend we see, it happens every single year in terms of movement and price, is a guy who was a fifth round wide receiver drafted, who doesn't have a starting spot on the team.

But those first few preseason games, he's gonna play a bunch because they're not you know, you're not gonna run out your starters right away.

And if he gets a 100 yards and a couple touchdowns, it's just the box score jumps out so loud at you that the market is not thinking, hey.

Is he gonna be getting snaps in week six? They're gonna be thinking, wow. What a game this guy's got potential. I'm not saying he doesn't, but I'm saying there's just, like, that is a time to sell that guy.

So, we see so much stuff come in of backup quarterbacks, of quarterbacks who are kinda journeymen who are gonna get snaps in the first preseason week because they're resting the starter and things like that.

I think it's just there's a lot of those cool little games you can play with, like, who can I sell at a different time? And, as always, just a million angles to take here.

So rather than me ranting on about the I don't know what you think or how you handle your football guys and when you look to sell, but that's kind of my general at least handful of thoughts on it.

Yeah. So maybe a good place to go and we'll just, like, put a laser focus on a specific group within football.

And I think it's always an entertaining exercise to dig into year two quarterbacks post rookie season going into the next season and how the market responds.

Obviously, we talked about Bo Nix who would fall into that window. And, Tory, I don't know why I'm doing this to myself, and I don't know why I'm causing myself this much pain.

But Give me a Anthony Richardson question. And and a perfect example would be talking about Anthony Richardson where he gets hurt, shows promise in year one, has moments, gets hurt on ice, and then what happens?

Right? Everyone spends the whole off season thinking Richardson's gonna be back. We saw what he did last year. It's all gonna be roses.

And then he doesn't have he for a myriad of reasons, he doesn't have the follow-up campaign that collectors, investors, Colts fans want. And so those who sold Richardson before the first week certainly capitalized.

But if you're holding Richardson during that time, you're like likely down bad. So I think going into this season, it's you last year, you had, you know, Stroud.

You had Young. You had Richardson. This year, you've got even more players who can follow a similar trajectory. I haven't looked at Jaden Daniels' prices right now, but I can only imagine what he's selling for right now.

So as you, like, maybe zero in and look and think about the year two quarterback of it all, it do you find and I I hate absolutes, but do you find that maybe the safest thing and maybe the trends you see at DC Sports eighty seven are more people trying to sell those cards as opposed to, you know, buying those those players, at this moment in time?

Like, what do you see? Yeah. Yeah. I would say our our guys who we work with who have a ton of inventory and are big singles dealers are generally selling those guys.

We we don't see a lot of holding there. And and, like, to your point a minute ago, if we look at the 23 class, what happened last year, it's very case by case.

It's like, okay. With CJ Stroud last year, it was, hey. Your rookie season, you had a phenomenal year. You win a playoff game, like, with this Texans team. So you come back, and it's almost a, hey. What's the guy have to do?

Like, to go up more, he's gotta have repeat that quality of season and go deeper to the playoffs. You have to get to a Super Bowl. Like, it's hard. It's almost the same with Jaden Daniels this year. Let's look at the year he had.

They get all the way, like, to the super I mean, it's just there's so much there. It's, it's tricky where it's if I'm holding a big Daniels card right now, you had a phenomenal year as a rookie, you add a weapon in Deebo Samuel.

You assume that the team is gonna do everything they can to make him succeed. And so most of what we see is the hype leading into the season. A ton of eyes are on him, and how's the soft work campaign gonna go?

Sell. Because, you know, I'm a Washington DC area native too. I remember 02/2012. I remember the football world were round revolving around RG three cards, and I remember what happened after that.

And so I am not saying that's happening to Daniels. I'm just saying there's a lot of, argument to be made for taking the sure thing on a hot player selling for big money, and I think that's what we see a lot of guys do.

I think the buying almost happens on the opposite end where it's the guys who say, hey.

Anthony Richardson's got it in him. Like, we've seen it, but, wow, the market's down on him. People wanna call him lazy. People say he underperformed. He's got an injury history now.

I think you see more speculative buys there where it's, hey. We get in kinda ground floor, and maybe this guy can go up. So, yeah, different different ends. I don't wanna, you know, compare Jim Daniels and Anthony Richardson.

That would be offensive to all my fellow Washington fans. But, you know, I I think it is it is that kind of case where you gotta look at the different quarterbacks, and I think, you know, that can go another way.

I think a lot of people were kinda down on Bryce Young after he got a little free for what he's selling for.

He played great last year. And so he's one of those guys we go, okay. Is this just gonna be a taking time, little seasoning in the league?

And so, while it is very case by case, it's situational on organization, coach, talent around him, performance, I think at the same time, the sure thing is if a guy's selling really well, you got profit to make.

You kinda take it, not worry about injury or team things changing and stuff like that. I wanna talk about maybe popular players, that you're seeing right now, what's coming through.

But as you were talking, it just like reminded me so much of and I would love for you to confirm or deny this. The feeling I have, it's over the last like three or four years.

Unproven Prospect quarterbacks have really be started to play the role similar to kind of the baseball prospecting where prior to it, yeah, there was hype and people were were were buying and selling, you know, unproven quarterbacks for high prices, probably higher than they they should be.

But it it just seems like it's taken a life of its own.

Obviously, football card collecting in the market has grown. Football is the most popular sport in America. But it it just really especially when I'm thinking about the national and what's gonna be in a lot of different showcases.

Do you think does it feel to you like this, quarterback unproven prospecting lane of the market has increased and is continuing to increase year over year?

Yeah. I I think so. And I think a lot of it is, you know, football's got ways you can kinda prospect like in baseball.

I think the unproven quarterback is a great example. But I think you also look at some of the deep sets, like, you know, contenders. You got a auto checklist a mile long where people can go after that guys.

And because in football, it's so the market is so heavy on quarterbacks, top top tier wide receivers, huge drop off running backs, huge drop off pretty much everybody else.

You you've got your rare defensive guy or tight end in there, but where I think you can get them for a relatively low entry price, then it's like, why not?

And I think it excuse me. I think in today's market too, people love that chase. They love to speculate.

They love a little bit of gamble. And it's so, hey. If I go grab a couple contenders autos of this guy that is, a second or third stringer but on a good team, and if so and so gets hurt, he gets to play and imagine what they could do.

Like, it's a fun game to play. And I think you too get especially as we've seen, like, NIL grow and we see more collegiate cards coming out of some of these guys, you've got a fan base that's collecting them starting earlier.

And so it's also every bit as much as it's, I wanna invest in this guy because maybe he gets a shot.

It's, hey. I was a Oregon fan, so I like Bo Nix or whatever. Like, you know, you come up with a lesser player, but, like, they're following them from earlier on.

And so I absolutely think you're right. We absolutely see that. And it is interesting as you see more of these, like, Boeing U products and things coming out that there's more and more speculation early on from some of those players.

Who are you seeing right now? Like, when when you go back and mails being open, like, what what players seem to be the most popular, right now?

Yeah. So we see a lot of the second year guys. For sure, there's a ton of Caleb Williams, Jaden Daniels, Bo Nix, Drake May, like, a lot of those guys coming in. I've also been seeing a ton of receiver stuff.

I I feel like this has evolved a little bit the last couple years with these mega contracts going to receivers and teams really relying more and more on them, but the Justin Jeffersons, the, I mean, even some of the older guys, the Stefon Diggs and players like that, Terry McLarens, and then some of the, you know, the Marvin Harrison juniors and recent year guys.

Yeah. I'm trying to think of other names, but just I feel like the receiver market is getting a lot more attention because these guys are more cornerstones of their teams.

And I think we've seen it just football's evolved this way. The running back's not really like the foundation of the offense anymore.

It almost feels like the revolving door for the system guy to pop in. And, there are some running backs that are certainly talented, and if we started playing the, you know, wins above replacement game, I get they qualify.

But with receivers, it's almost like more of a persona and more attention drawn to them. And so, we're seeing a lot of that come in along with the usual, you know, QBs leading up to the season.

Do you do you think it not just being and I I've your observations are similar to the observations I've made, and it feels like it's it it makes for a healthy, healthier experience for buying into football cards for everyone, whether you're buying into breaks, collecting your favorite player, selling.

What what sort of impact do you think it makes to have it not just be solely focused on quarterbacks a category, but now we're starting to see, you know, another whole another position.

And there's a whole another line of prospects and a whole another line of top 10 best receivers in the league.

Like, what do you think the emergence of another skill position in football cards has maybe done for the overall market and collectors who are in it? Sorry. I put that out of the way for answers.

Yeah. No. I I think it's good. I think it's, it's great because we need, we need broader draws. You know? You don't want everything to be so top heavy where it's all we do is look at a product and say, okay.

What was the QB rookie class that that year? And it's kind of that's the end all be all of the quality of the product or who there is to chase.

So knowing that there is more depth there and knowing that we're going after receivers, knowing that, you know, players can be interesting who are not just throwing the ball, like, that that really helps a lot.

I think as you look at the last handful of years and it's Justin Jefferson, Ja'Marr Chase, Tee Higgins, Marcus Harrison Junior, there's all these other guys who have come along, it adds a lot of interest.

And a lot of times, the top of the draft can become so QB heavy that the nice thing too is usually the big, big premier wide receivers aren't gonna be drafted by the same team that drafted that elite QB one through five.

And so when we look at products and rookies, you know, the teams are spread more out too. So if you're getting into breaks, if you're, you know, doing something like that too, you've got more, things to go after.

And just, again, the more there is to chase, the healthier it is for the market because the more it kinda spreads out the value of products and the more there is, not just all the money flowing into one or two players. So, all for it.

Love to see it, and I think it's, it's good too because when you've got a team that's got a QB who's been established for five or ten years, we're now saying there's a couple other positions whether it's just wide receiver, it's wide receiver in tight end or whatever where a guy can emerge.

And there's less of that ceiling where it's, hey. There's only one guy who's gonna start on that team. Well, there might be two or three wide receivers.

So if we get more money going after the wide receiver market, it's great to see that kinda spreading out because there's more opportunities for them to kind of blossom as the season goes on.

I love it. We've said a lot here, and maybe let's close out this segment by I in any advice you you would share with either buyers or sellers of football cards based on trends or anything you've seen during this moment in time?

Like, the national, does it have an impact? Like, anything you wanna share as we close this segment out.

Yeah. I I mean, I think the national matters for sure. I we can't say it doesn't, you know, along with Fanatics Fest, which has, I guess, cemented itself as the other of the top two now, you know, biggest show of the year.

So, just, you know, figure out what your priorities are is number one. You know, is there stuff you wanna buy as the season starts? If so, maybe sell some of your big QB cards or other things now.

Look at the schedule. Do you think it's gonna be a great start to the year for your player and then get a lot more challenging, or is it gonna start really challenging and then soften up?

That does matter. You know, look at what's happened to the team around them. Have they added weapons? Things like that. So, just do a little bit of homework.

You know, look at where they're selling now. Maybe go back and look at where they sold leading up to the season last year or mid season last year. All those trends really do matter. I think a lot of the market is cyclical.

Be willing to put a little bit of time in and study that stuff. But if you want the absolute safe thing, what we've seen in my opinion, give it, you know, four to six weeks from right now, then we'll get selling.

We're a lot closer to the season. We're kinda more distanced from basketball and hockey. It's down to just football and baseball, and then you can really capitalize.

And I think that's the time to do it and, especially on the higher end stuff. You can kinda take the sure bet the sure money, market's gonna be up, and kinda go from there.

Tory, I bet this isn't the the only episode that we're gonna be talking about football cards. I'm sure, especially as we get into the season, it's gonna be a primary, topic of conversation.

So glad we could cover that to help set the stage. Definitely another fun action packed episode of the staging area. We'll have links to DC Sports eighty seven's, eBay store in the show notes.

Always just some bangers coming through there that you don't wanna miss, and, definitely hit the website if you're looking to consign your sports cards on eBay. Definitely hit up DC Sports eighty seven.

Tory, before I let you get out of here, any anything you wanna close with, updates, anything the audience should know about? Yeah. I think biggest update for us, this fall, we'll be having a mobile app come out.

So, you know, one of the biggest piece of feedback for us is that things are, super easy to do on our website. They're not as friendly as people want them on mobile.

I know the world lives mobile these days. So, we're we're listening and acting on that. So we'll have both an iOS and Android version of the app coming out probably September ish of this year.

To make everything a lot easier, we'll have, you know, kinda daily snapshot notifications telling you what you had sell and go up in the last day, you know, notifications where your items go live.

A lot easier to communicate with us in a more kinda text like messaging system, things like that. So, that's another big thing we're working on along with the national, but very excited to kinda make that, public.

We'll be having some kind of preview, you know, videos, screenshots, things like that coming out in the coming month or two. But, that is the the biggest update we've got as far as, things going on here at the shop.

Awesome, man. Well, looking forward to many more of these episodes ahead. Thank you everyone for checking out the staging area. Looking forward to sharing the nest next conversation with you.