Going on. Excited about this conversation. We're gonna be talking about chasing one of ones, a collector journey, into one of ones, probably most specifically talking about the super fracture.

And I am joined by Michael at Roundtree thirteen cards. I was looking, Michael. I think the last time we did one of these was in August of last year.

So first, how are you doing, and how has it been, since August, I guess, with you and your collection? Yeah. I'm doing great. Thanks for having me, Brett. With my collection, my collection's is, in a good place, I think.

I haven't slowed down. In fact, just continuing to kinda just, pick up and buy things and learn. So it's been going great. Ready for summer. Have maybe before we get into the topic, have you been I know you're in the area.

Have you been going to the Dallas card shows? Yeah. Yeah. I try to go, you know, I've got two kids so I can make it, like, one day. And, I set up with a with a buddy. He always has space for me, DFW Card Hunter.

Shout out, Jason. But, yeah, it's it's it's crazy crazy busy every time. I've been going on Fridays, and I I think the Saturdays are even crazier because they do a really good job of getting people in there to sign autographs.

So I I think the last time we talked, you were telling a story about, like, buying a some crazy cards in a collection. There was a a a Pedro involved, and we were digging in.

I think when we first met, I kinda first started knowing you as a kind of a nineties baseball collector, which is an amazing collection. But more recently, I've seen you you getting involved in more of one of ones and super factors.

So maybe, like, let's start with you've been collecting for a long time, and I would love for you to maybe talk about, like, the different eras or different phases of your collecting journey and just, maybe the card like, types of cards that have been a part of each of those phases, and then we'll get into kinda the current day, one of one of it all.

Yeah. Yeah. That's, and I have related to some of the topics you've had lately where you talk about it's okay to change, you know, or, you know, just, you know, the evolution.

And, you know, when I when I first started in the nineties, I was collecting Tim Duncan and Kobe Bryant because that's what my older brother collected.

And, when I got back into the hobby around 2020 and kinda was in it a little bit in the, you know, 2010 to 02/2020, but not not really.

But, I got back into COBie, and that lasted about six months. And then I was like, man, this mark this is too expensive.

And so I had acquired a few. I sold some of that, and I was kind of searching for, you know, what I wanted to collect, who I wanted to collect, and I started to think back to just memories of the 02/2005.

And Randy Johnson was was the guy that always stuck out to me as, like, this dominant. And I pitched too as well.

I've said that on a on a prior podcast. But, you know, I went all in on Randy Johnson buying everything and learning. And I think that's, like, the the consistent is, like, when I go all in, like, I'm just trying to learn.

Like, what what do I want? What sticks? So I acquired a huge Randy Johnson collection, and then had this urge to narrow it down to, like, top 20, and I did that.

And there are a few that have not come to auction or or available that I still would buy. But I think for me, it's like acquiring and learning, and that's what I did with Randy Johnson that I narrowed that down.

And then there are I'm just waiting on a few cards waiting on a few cards to pop up out of 50 in the nineties, and they just don't pop up.

And so I started to explore and learn about February to 02/2010, what was shiny, what looked good.

And, that's kinda what got me into this space is, you know, just exploring and found that there are some amazing cards that are just crazy shiny that compared to a lot of nineties.

You know? So I I love the backdrop with the Johnson collecting just to set the stage for the super fracture collecting.

I I would before we move into super fractures, like, you said you were just waiting for some cards to pop up, and I would imagine, like, you had, like, a checklist of these are the, Randy Johnson cards that I want.

Maybe shine a light shine a light on what you like about player collecting and being focused around a player, and maybe talk about what you don't like.

I heard my kid about to come in. My kids. Anyways, what what I player collecting, well, it's it's you have to be very patient and disciplined with that, and I'm not patient or disciplined.

And, you know, you just you want you want mail days. But I think with with super factors and kind of baseball in general because I don't I don't go for super factors in football or basketball.

Maybe some football, but not basketball. But you have to be very patient and disciplined as a player collector after you get to a certain point.

Well, you know, because some cards just don't pop up ever. So yeah. So so so what was it a specific card, or was there a specific moment where you kind of sharpen your focus around super fractures?

What led you to where you are today? Yeah. Well, I'm a Texas Ranger fan, and, you know, they won the World Series in 2023.

God. It's already been two. And I wanted something to capture that moment. So I just started looking at, you know, super modern, like, you know, cards, and I found the, Corey Seager one of one, let you know, let's go parallel.

But you once you start going down that path and you want more, and then I I wanted every card that kinda captured that moment, which led to kind of understanding, you know, that market a little bit more.

And what that does when you when your team wins in 2023, then all of a sudden, you you start to know who the closer is, and you start to know who I mean, you you start to it's like almost as if you're just into MLB now.

And and so it got me got me really into current day MLB, which I started buying other players too as well, which led to a lot of learning as to, you know, what what looks good and what doesn't look good.

So I I'm I would this is, like, adjacent to kind of the topic, but something that's on my mind a lot recently, like, as a as a Pacers fan and, like, being involved in this, like, magical run, it's like, I have, like, paused everything else, and all I wanna do is, like, focus in on, like, making sure whatever happens, like, I'm commemorating this run with key pieces.

And you your your team hit the mountain top and, you know, won the world series, which I don't know if you were expecting it or not, but, maybe, like which this is interesting because, like, you grab the player in a super fracture that reminds you of your mountaintop moment as a fan, and then you just said, I want more of it.

When what maybe describe, like, that connection of a fandom and collecting when the maybe the most important thing on your mind in that moment was making sure you are buying cards that could remind you of the feeling that you had when your team won the World Series.

I think it's natural to kinda wanna stay in that moment and and just be there, because it's such a it's such a a high, you know, to be in that moment.

And and, you know, like, that you you you'll you'll also see, like, reels on Instagram that that recapture certain moments for your teams, and that can bring you back.

But to have a to have a card that you look at and you say, well, I remember exactly where I was when that happened. I mean, that just brings you back.

I mean, you you really can't put a a price on that. I mean And and you you didn't just stop at the one, Corey Seager. What what what what happened after you got the first, first one? Well, that's that's, like, the type of person I am.

I I'm learn I'm learning is, like, I'm so, like, here's all the Bowman Chrome one of ones of Corey Seager, you know, which I was really surprised. They came to market, but, pretty quickly.

And, you know, I mean, it's Corey Seager. It's not Aaron Judge, but, I bought the, the Helix one of one. I found that. The stadium club and stadium club is sneaky. Stadium club is really a great super factor.

I don't know why they're so cheap compared to Bowman Chrome and Tox Chrome, but, yeah, exactly. There it is right there. So I found all three cards that really capture that moment and bought them.

And, yeah, I'm I'm definitely the buyer you want if, if you have something that I want. I have no patience. Yes. So you you you bought these cards, signified the moment, one of ones. You bought more Bowman stuff.

How did you, like, how did, like, this experience because you you weren't buying ultra modern, but you had a reason to because your team won and you wanted to connect to the moment, and then you get the type of card, you get a super fracture.

How did, like, that this moment help launch you into kind of this new era of collecting that you're going through with super fractures?

Well, what this does is when you when you get that card in the mail, how do you how do you feel about it?

Do you put it on your desk, or you do you keep it in the envelope and tuck it away? I think you've learned a lot about what looks good, what doesn't look good.

And just because it's a one on one doesn't mean that it's going to be a great card or is a great card, because Panini, Fanatics, Topps, Bowman, they're they're just producing them at a a really high rate.

And so Mhmm. You know, by buying a lot of different super factors, it's an expensive way to learn, but at the same time, it's what I'm trying to do. I'm trying to figure out what years look better than others.

And and this one this one is a really cool one. This is 02/2010 Joe Mauer. Joe Mauer. I don't collect Joe Mauer, but I'm telling you, like, 02/2010 Bowman Chrome did something to me.

Like, it it it it showed me, like, this is an amazing set, and then it makes you curious about 02/2009, '2 thousand '11, '2 thousand '8. You kinda go down that rabbit hole of, okay, what are the differences between each year?

They all look good. What looks great? I love this thread a lot. This idea of in this era of super fractures, like, there's we can even just focus on super fractures.

Like, I use this example all the time, but, like, w w Topps got the WWE license again. And in the checklist, there were, like because they wanted 14 titles. There's, like, 14 Charlotte Flairs and 14 Randy Ortons.

And each of those e cards all have super fractures. So you've got this checklist with multiple cards and all these super fractures, and it just becomes, I think, confusing for for new collectors coming in.

So, like, there's a proliferation of the super fracture in the modern day, but then you rewind the tape and it's like it's a lot different. Right? There's just maybe just one, which is the way I think most collectors want it to be.

Maybe, like, as you have navigated like, it sounds like you're going through, like, this phase of just navigating what super fractures, like, make you feel something, and you're picking up cards like that Joe Mauer.

Like, what have you learned by maybe studying the the iterations and the different era of super fractures throughout, you know, you know, tops products. Yeah. I I've learned that I want the super fracture to look good in the dark.

And and what I what I mean by that is, like, you you you get some and you have to go outside. I'm trying to take a picture of it, and I'm like, this should not be this hard to make this part look great.

And so what what I've noticed is that some years, they'll have the they'll have the super factor, like, all the way around the borders, and I think that's that's one of the key things that is, like, has to be, in place for for a super factor.

I mean, look look how, you know, the whole card shines.

Now there are some amazing super factors out there where there is a border and and then it has the the logo the the the super factor scope, you know, within, and, they look great too.

But I think I feel like this is what I'm really drawn to and, you know, tops chrome from o nine to 02/2014, they knock it out of the park.

Bowman Chrome, the early stuff, oh my gosh. Like, it is this this is a a great example. I think 02/2005 is just beautiful. So I've got the the day the David Ortiz, and then I it started with the Kerry Wood.

So I found the Kerry Wood in Dallas, and, I had to have that. And, you know, I bought that. And then this popped up on auction on Golden a couple weeks ago, and I just went all in on it, sold some cards, and, you know, had to have it.

So these where and I am not as in tuned with you know, I believe the believe the super fracture started in Bowman Chrome baseball. Fractures were in 02/2005, Finest or Chrome, I believe.

What is is is o '5 Bowman Chrome the first super fractures, or did it come out a year before? Do you know? So Tops Chrome and Finest also had a one of one that year, but that was the first year that they did.

But Tops Chrome kinda put gold refractor on the back of theirs in baseball, and there's an amazing Jeter at auction right now on Golden, and, it's not mine. I would I would love to have it.

But, you know, the tops chrome, Bowman chrome finest, they all had the one of one. Finest. I think finest actually had, like, four different variations of a one of one, so it kinda takes away from that to me a little bit.

But they're they're beautiful. I don't know a lot about the o five finest, but Bowman Chrome actually came out third, I believe, in August of that year. And, finest or top scrum came out early that year.

So but that was the first year. So I saw, like, I saw this card when you posted it, and I and instantly, I just read the profile of this card and then saw this card. And I was like, this is just an outstanding card.

Maybe, like, as you're moving into this new era where you're focusing on super fractures, like, maybe talk about, like, what what were all the element? Was it is it the the player, the card itself, a combination of all those?

Like, what what got you to the point where you were like, I'm gonna sell cards in my collection to fund this because I I I think this card is a card I need in my collection.

Yeah. Well, it started when I got to Cary Wood. I immediately was like, okay. How do I get more of these? You know? And so then you kind of set your safe searches, and you're looking for that.

And this popped up, and this was a this was I I'm sure there are a lot of Red Sox collectors out there that that would probably enjoy this card maybe more than me.

But but I I remember David Ortiz in that o four playoff run, how clutch he was, and I thought this was really cool that it was the the year after and the first Super Crafter.

And, you know, for whatever reason, I just really went all in on supporting the Red Sox that playoff run. I mean, the Rangers weren't good, but it's kinda like you wanna root for somebody.

You want the underdog and and, I was I feel like I celebrated as much as not probably as much as Red Sox fans, but you know, I I was I was passionate about them winning that.

I thought it was unbelievable. They came back from three o, and I'll just never forget, you know, watching that playoff run and those late night games they had, and he was a hero.

And so to own that card, I feel like it just brings me back to, you know, being in college and watching those games. So you you, said something that I think is true to a lot of collectors.

You mentioned you picked up the Cary Wood, and you you love the card. And you're like, well, how do I get more of these? And then you so it because you had one, it made you want the Ortiz even more.

As you're exploring the different iterations and eras of super fractures and finding the cards that, you know, when it's dark, it still shines, how much of, like, you and your hunt and your pursuit has been to find comparable players of cards in super fracture years that you really like, finding other ones to pair them with?

How much of that has been a part of your current chase? Well, the the only other thing I'm looking for is just a specific Randy Johnson card from the nineties.

So it's been a huge part of what I look at. I mean, you wake up, you check eBay, you go to bed, you check eBay, you're out of the pool bed.

Golden and Fanatics have really been the place where a lot of this has been popping up, though, a lot more it seems over the last six months, and I think it's smart.

It's a one of one. Doesn't matter the player. There's gonna be collectors out there that want it, and their auction format is really, I think, the right place for, Superfractors because you get the back and forth.

I know I've, gone over what I thought I would bid before just because you get caught up in it. And so, but I spend a lot of time looking for them, and they don't pop up every day.

And you and when they do, they hit you, and you're like, oh oh, crap. I've got twenty days here, to wait for this auction to close or fourteen days or whatever the auction format is. But, yeah, they don't pop up every day.

I've I've observed in the football collecting community that there are a lot of Super Fracture focused collectors where it's like, you look at their page, and it's just, like, a lot of different Super Fractures of a lot of players that made us feel something.

And so it's not necessarily about the team or the player, but it's the fact that it's Super Fracture. And if it's up for auction, chances are they'll be bidding on that.

Have you found since you're posting your cards, have you found that there's maybe, like, a network or community of Superfractures collectors in baseball who are maybe doing similar adjacent, collecting to you?

I I mean, you had summertime, I think, was the the collector on it. And, the he I met him in Dallas. Great guy. And, you know, I I I see what he's doing, and I I it makes sense to me.

And there are a few others that I'll follow their pages, and they'll have, super factors and and one of one specific to this this time frame, and I'll bug them a little bit.

They'll they'll message back. I mean, the it's people are always willing to share. And I do have a few, dealers that go out to every show, and they'll always let me know if they see something or you know?

Because I'll buy it and or trade them something. So How how different is so you mentioned, like, there's, like, one Randy Johnson card on your list that you're looking for. So you're, like, very pointed and focused around that.

But this type of collecting to me seems like maybe it's more reactionary because you don't you don't necessarily know what other o five Bowman Chrome super fracture is gonna pop up that you see and you're like, I need that.

How how is that, like, approach being very targeted to maybe being more open to what comes? Like, how has that maybe, changed the way or shifted the way you think about acquiring cards for your collection?

Well, it keeps it it keeps it new. And, it's it's certainly exciting because you don't know what's gonna pop up. And and, you know, Drake did a a story sale. I think it was two, three, four weeks ago.

I don't know. But, he had a a Drew Brees, super factor on there. And I used to fancy football. I used to always draft Drew Brees. Oh, oh, you know, and, I'm like, oh, I want that. And, it almost took me down that lane.

And I I held off because I was get getting ready for this auction, you know, and and and and I still think about that card. But, you know, we just don't know what's gonna pop up, and that's kinda fun. I mean, like, I am not Yes.

Making money in cards. So I I I am making bad decisions from a investment standpoint, but I also think that has led me to one of ones because it doesn't hurt that much because if I overspend for a one on one, that's what it's worth.

You know? So Have you like, we've talked about, like, the, you know, patience and how maybe we're not the most patient people.

Maybe by being dads, we've had to learn more patience. And just Yeah. On your with with these cards, like, that don't pop up every day. Like, how have you been able to manage your patience?

You're I know you're looking everywhere all of the time, but there's probably weeks that go by with nothing that you're interested in pop up. Like, how have you managed your patience around new acquisition when cards aren't popping up?

Well, and and I don't have a daily mail day, and and that's okay. I think when you start buying bigger cards, you can't have daily mail days. And, you know, you I I listen to a lot of different podcasts that talk about the card market.

Really enjoy those. And you just start asking questions to people that have certain cards or another underrated thing. Just go on Instagram, go to the search field, type in Superbractor, and just see what comes up.

And you'll go down a rabbit hole that will your hours will go by, and you'll just go to people's pages that you're not following, and you'll start to see cards that they posted two, three years ago.

And maybe you send them a message and say, hey.

Do you still have this? Would you take an offer on this? And I've done that before, and sometimes nobody responds because their page has gone dead or they sold the card or they're just not responsive.

But sometimes they reply back, and they're like, you know, I still have it. I would move it. So I would love maybe, like and we've you've shared some of your cards already, but I don't know if you have any of them around.

But maybe, like, through your journey of, buying super fractures, and you've talked about the o five Bowman Chrome Mortise and why you like it.

Are there are there any specific other years? You talked about the the Mauer, but cards that stand out to you in terms of the way the super factor is designed, for that year.

Yeah. And I'm still learning. So, you know, there's there's probably other people too. But I I think for one of the newer sets, I really like Topps chrome, like, the 2022.

It this is the trout, and I I think it it they do a really good job, you know, on this card. It just has really good shine. So 2022 Tots Grown is up there.

But I I talked to with this trout, like, I would imagine I know trout's been you know, he had the injury and his market went down, but I would have you know, he's still one of the most popular players in baseball.

Like, what it what is it like acquiring this guy in this era?

He's, like, extremely collectible and popular in a set like Topps Chrome in the best parallel you can you can get? Like, how hard it how hard was this card to acquire for you?

I mean, not too hard. It it you know you know how it is. Like, he had his prime, and, hopefully, he comes back this year, but he had a a good run where he was the best player in baseball.

And so if you were to buy a top scrum super practor, you know, like a Aaron Judge today, you're gonna pay a lot more.

Mhmm. But people's prime comes and goes, and then the market softens. And I think that's what we're experiencing with Trout. But he's going to hopefully play for, I don't know, five more years and do great things.

But at some point, people are going to remember how great he was. And I think that's where you'll see his market take off again, but I'm just enjoying the cards now.

And, you know, I I do think he'll have his time again. Kinda like Griffey. I mean, Griffey wasn't killing it with the Reds. You know? But he's the number one guy in the nineties for baseball. So Trout will have his moment again.

And, same with, like, Bryce Harper too. I mean, he's he's an unbelievable player. If you collected in 02/1213, I mean, like, you you knew that name. You knew he was coming to the MLB, and his stuff was so crazy expensive.

Now it's not. And so Is is there is there any other, awesome trout card, by the way? Are there any other, supers that you haven't talked about that you wanna highlight in your collection?

Man, I I bought a I bought a, Adrian Beltre, Superfractor that I think is just amazing. I was in here looking for it. Like, oh, here it is. I showed this on on Instagram.

Oh, dude. Yes. I love that year. This year well, and I think it's 09/2014. ToxChrome killed it. They they did they did a great job. But, okay, with this card, it's sold for a thousand dollars maybe a year and a half ago at auction.

And I remember when it sold, I went into Superpractors like I am now, and I let it go because I wasn't in a good place to to buy it at the time.

But fast forward a year, and I knew who had it, and I messaged him. And this this is a great topic too because how do you approach somebody when something's not for sale, when it's Superbractor one zero one?

Because I had people approach me. And the first thing they'll ask you is, is this available? Can you sell this? But as a collector, you know that once you say something is available, then it then it kinda diminishes it.

Yes. So you don't wanna say it's available. And and because you start to go down that path about it it's in this other pile of cards that can be sold.

And so, you know, I approached him and I said, I will pay you this amount of money for this card. And I think I offered him $17. 50. Did you know the did you know the owner?

Like, did you have any sort of relationship with him? No. No. Okay. And and Perfect. I was polite. I said, amazing card. You paid a thousand. I didn't say that. I know he paid a thousand. He had it graded, so maybe he's into an 1,100.

I said, I will pay you $1,750 for this card. Will you take this? He politely said no. He PC'd Beltre. I said, okay. If you change your mind, I might be able to come up a little bit, but that's out there.

He said, thank you. We talked a little bit about other cards. I came back two, three months later. Hey. I I will pay you $2,000 for this card. He said politely, no. If that changes, I'll contact you first.

Yada yada yada. Great guy. Seems very nice. I come back a little bit later. I will pay you $2,100 for this card. And that and that happened for a good, I don't know, maybe ten months, eleven months, twelve almost a year.

And then finally, I said, I will pay you $2,500 for this card. And I think I also wanted a $30 card he had of Mike Napoli. But at the same time, I'm paying you know, he bought it for a thousand, maybe he's into it for 1,100.

I'm paying over two times what that is. And I think if you're trying to acquire something that's not for sale, you have to have that mindset of, like, I'm going to overpay for this compared to what it was a year and a half ago.

That's not to say that that that card's worth $2,500, but it's a one of one, and I really like it. And, sure, I wish I bought it for a thousand or whatever, but it is now.

It's worth it's worth what I just paid for it, because I'm not selling it for anything less than that or I'm not selling it at all. So don't take that the wrong way, anybody.

But but I think as you approach people that for cards that aren't for sale, if you ask them, is this available, then they have to say yes or no or and then they start to go down a path of, like, okay.

This this is something I would part with, and people don't wanna do that, I don't think.

And so come with a number. Let them say yes or no. If they ghost you, your offer's too low. If they say thank you, I will think of you in the future. Maybe you're onto something. Come back, offer more, or don't.

It's your money. It's their card. That's that's what I would do. The this is this is, like, profound wisdom, and I know there's a lot of dealer friends that I know that are, like, standing up applauding what you just said.

And I think it's so important. If you really want the card, just cut out all the layers and just give a lead with a price and especially because the card's not being promoted as it's being for sale.

Back to the Beltre, what what was it what is it about that card specifically that kept that kept you coming back and doing what you were doing, chasing it until you got it?

What what is it about the card? So so Beltre, he had a way of hitting a home run and almost being on one knee when he hit a home run. And it was just very strange but iconic.

And and you you see he's got that pose. Yeah. And he was known for that. He was known for him and Elvis kinda, Elvis Elvis Andrews, the shortstop, kinda playing around with each other, their relationship.

You also didn't wanna touch his head. So, like, he had these things that you kinda remind you of him in in addition to in a gold glove third basement and just a guy hall of fame, no doubt guy.

So it's the pose. It's it captures something that you kinda remember of that player, And it also was the first Tops Chrome super him and a rangers jersey. So, you know, it it checked it checked all the all the buckets.

Before we get off of this card, that like, what you just said just is a display of, like, how deeply personal collecting is. I don't think anybody who is gonna like, it's some were well, someone were to sell that card on a marketplace.

They're not gonna put in the description, like, look. It's the pose, but, like, you recognize the pose. And that is probably a reason why you just kept coming back with stronger and stronger offers.

They you've been collecting for a long time. Like, how important is, like, that that and you you talked about Ortiz and being in college and watching that run and you remembering it.

Like, how important are those memories to you in paying what you're paying for these cards? I think it's what makes cards, like, stick in your collection.

I think I think it it it has to remind you of something, because there are a lot of cards that look good out there. But that card should remind you of something if it's gonna stay in your collection for a really long time, I think.

So it's training for it. I love this. Maybe as we're rounding this chat out, there's probably a lot of people going to, eBay searching super fractures right now, getting excited.

We're all on different points of our journey, but I guess what what advice would you have for any collectors who are thinking about, whether it's super fractures or not, thinking about narrowing their focus but hesitant to make a big shift like you have from player PC to being being like, okay.

I'm collecting super factors that connect with me. What would you say to any of those collectors going through that?

I'd say stay away. Get get out of get out of my lane. I would I would say I mean, I think I think you have to there there are two ways to learn. You know? You you you observe and you ask questions or you go through it yourself.

And so it's an expensive, lesson to buy, to learn. I think conversation and just seeing what other collectors are doing and why and asking why, I think that's an that that's a a more, reasonable way to do it.

I would not say I did done that, but I have done some of it. But, so so I would say observe. Ask questions. If someone posts a card that they're extremely proud of, and I would ask them, like, what do you like about this year?

What do you like about this card? Where where are you finding cards? You know? That's what I would ask them. You can follow him on Instagram at roundtree thirteen cards.

If you got any look at his page. If you got any and you heard him talk. If you got any cool, super fractures, I'm sure he wouldn't mind you sliding into, his DMs and seeing if he's interested or not.

But, Michael, this was a ton of fun. Appreciate you coming back on and talking cards. Yeah. Thanks, Brett. Appreciate you having me.