alright excited to jump into today's topic it is one that has been on my mind as a collector as a basketball fan and as i was sitting thinking about this topic i knew my good friend rodney at enjoycardsig was in a similar boat so i think it'd be fun to talk about maybe maybe not fun but maybe kind of fun to talk through collecting through an injury you know we have spent the last you know it feels like forever it hasn't even been a year but collecting tyrese halliburton on the other side of his catastrophic injury in game seven of the nba finals and i know we're not alone like a lot of us have gone through these cycles and phases and i think it tests us as collectors but it also illuminates a lot of really good stuff for us as collectors so that's what we're gonna talk about today and i'm excited for rodney to be here rodney welcome back man how you doing good man it's i'm excited to do this i mean you know i'm with you it it it's a it's a really sensitive topic that is i mean it's it's easier to talk about now than you know you know eight months ago but i i love talking cards i love talking basketball and it kinda just helps soothe everything over so yeah man i'm excited to do this again this will be hopefully therapy for the both of us but may maybe if you're and and i have not really done like a dedicated conversation with another collector about this although this has been on my mind as i'm assuming it probably has for you as we've been suffering through this pacer season but maybe we go back and i hate to do this but we're gonna open up the the wounds a little bit maybe let's talk about game seven and the injury and i think before we do that we can talk about the run and we'll start with the good and then maybe end with the bad but maybe like share some perspective for you as a a pacers fan and the run that we went on last year oh man yeah it's wow i can just feel everything just kinda flooding back over me like the emotions at once it's pretty emotional i mean you know you and i are weird diehard pacers fans and and halliburton fans and so we knew some things that a lot of the casual fans and even i think a lot of the a lot of the sort of talking heads didn't know didn't realize just how special this team was you know they went on the run the year before and you know the season sort of mixed results you know along the way with you know really peaking at the right time but that was not that was not any ordinary playoff run that is you know i mean that i i i've been watching nba ball for for a good amount of time i used to watch college ball it was kind of my my thing of choice but i watch a lot more nba now but even the even people who have been watching basketball for thirty forty years they talked about how run that special how special that run was i mean it was just you know the drama of the i mean just the clutch shots the last minute finishes the the unique style of play of the team i mean it was just you know i always believed but with every win i believed more and more so the buildup you know to the finals was just i mean i i just the energy that was just pulsing in my body for game seven i mean i just i could not i couldn't even really think straight when i'm sitting there watching this game you know i don't know how it was for you if that any of that resonates yeah big time i mean i've in reflection it's really hard in the moment but in reflection you know i've been a a fan of sports and a fan of basketball my entire life and the run experiencing that run and making the impromptu decisions like thinking about the game six against the knicks at home where i just like woke up and was like i don't care what it cost me i have to be there and to be at a closeout game to do the same thing for game six in the finals after i already had spent a ton of money in picking the wrong game and being there for that insanity in game six of the finals i look back on that time and it it it as a fan like these are the moments that i think we all aspire to experience and we invest in and man i don't know how many times i've watched the clips and the remixes of all the moments and i i it never gets old so certainly a run and you know sitting through all the reggie miller moments and all those pacers season nothing compares to last season for me and i think it going into the run i knew that halliburton had a special place in my heart and then after the run and after everything happened i i the talking point that i've been saying is that tyrese halliburton is my favorite basketball player of all time and i i legitimately mean that like nobody has given me as much joy watching the game as him so yeah i i i tend not to try to get down in the dumps with this season we're having here at fifteen and forty six at the time of recording but you know i said to you it's like you know when you take the engine out of the vehicle like it just doesn't work the same and we're seeing that so i guess like for you and it sucks but when when it happened like in the game seven that happened like what was going on in your head like we'll get to the cards part but like what was going on in your head as a fan oh man so i mean so i i i've i was i'm a duke grad and i went to a couple of national i was there when they won back to back national championships so i i went to one of those games actually in indianapolis and i've seen some big some big games but this is as a fan of nba basketball this was by far they're never i mean and and this was such an improbable run i mean amongst the masses you know i mean and so i mean i just i mean i really i i was so hyped i mean i was so hyped that i just i go to the bedroom i have a i have this little camping chair that sort of folds out that i can sit at the end of the bed so they get really close to the tv to see what's going on i have my peanuts i have my beer i just you know i've been thinking about it all day long but it's i mean i can't i mean i i feel like i mean i feel like i'm there on the court with the players to some degree as a fan like i just the energy is so much it takes me time to just settle into the game you know and just get all these thoughts like what what's gonna happen i mean gosh we could you know you're and you're going through the like we could actually be like it just it was hard to sink in like we could actually be the champions of the nba like this is just this is insane and you're you're thinking about you know how this is gonna go and okc is just such a daunting opponent and and and we all know we all know that like if halliburton gets off to a hot start man a lot more times than not it works out in the in the pacers favor and he i mean he was just he was on fire man i mean he was just i mean you could feel it you could sense i mean it was just you know and we knew we knew he was playing hurt we didn't know how hurt so that was one thing you know like what you know is he gonna be a hundred percent but i mean he was he was a hundred and fifty percent coming out she was like oh man i'm like i'm i'm as i build up to it it's just it's crushing again inside i mean i'm about to cry yeah man and it and it just it happened have you ever seen the movie magnolia oh yeah yeah absolutely alright you know the ending scene when the frogs are when it's raining frogs and yeah thumping down on the cars and stuff like it's a much more serious thing you know and it's about how the know someone dealing with the loss of of of someone who was close to them and i took it and then i later saw the the director talk about it and he confirmed what my suspicions were was that that's that scene was meant to symbolize how hard it is for you to wrap your your head around certain types of losses right and that was much more significant it was a movie but the the situation so you know it's not the same but it was a similar dynamic of just when it happened i let i my brain would not check the box that he's injured and he's out for the game and he's probably gonna be out for all next season wouldn't check that box for several minutes you know just utter disbelief and i mean again i felt like i was there in the game with everybody like everyone was rattled i was right i i just yeah i had to gather myself and then you know halftime comes and you're like oh god i got i got just some time to try to process this and then i'm like well shit we're we're actually up you know like so there's a lot of emotions after that just like oh man can we come back and can we still win can we still win this yeah i just it was too much is it my brain just my brain just couldn't handle it i mean i i don't know what what was where were you and what was it like for you yeah so i will never forget the scene because it was the significance of the game in game seven was so massive i was probably like you and other pacers fans especially on the day of it's literally all that you can think of and it's all consuming and i'll never forget like my kids being in bed and the game starting and me being on the couch my wife was like walking around the kitchen because she's kind of a a a busy bee when it comes to these types of games she can't like sit so she's like and i am i remember them going for the like getting ready for the tip and i'm just like i can't believe this is happening and then i'm like training myself to be like this is a big hurdle and then halliburton starts gunning it's like that's what he's doing he's gunning threes and he hits three of them and i'm like holy shit and then when it happened i it was like one of the more indescribable feelings i ever had where i'm sitting there because instantly i had this weird feeling with the calf that worst case scenario was the achilles because we've seen it before in other players and when he went down like in real time achilles that that's what went in my head and then instantly like not gonna play next season and just starting to process all of that and just like it felt like a tragedy in a way and so he goes off the court and these guys are playing again and i'm sitting there and dude i have never felt so numb and a game with that the stakes that high and like i'm like looking back on it i'm like how many more of these do i get in my life an opportunity to watch my team in a game seven and dude i i was like emotionless even when they were up at halftime i was emotionless because i felt so bad for tyrese and i just i will i i just in in the fight in this like this fight going round after round with this team i just was like i just like it got real to me really quickly where i was like there's i didn't wanna say i lost my belief but i know and we see that this year how important tyrese is to the pacers and so i didn't i wasn't optimistic and yeah yeah i'd i'm not sure i'm not sure i've quite been the same since but now we're kind of on the other side of it so i think that's good but i wanted to maybe dig into like at what point in this juncture for you did you start talk thinking about like your collection or halliburton cards like how did you approach it oh yeah well i mean a lot like you i mean that it it just took some time i just had to i just had to process everything you know it sounds so dramatic but you know it's basketball but god it it really did it really did affect me and you know it was just there were so many things that i had to sort out in my mind you know just sort of like the disappointment i mean just i couldn't tell you the number of times weeks and and even man even sometimes now i just i think about it and i go damn it ugh you know like oh we we're right there i still have those thoughts you know but they're less and less you know i thought of and then the next thing i thought about is like man the whole reason i'm a pacers fan is because of halliburton you know didn't grow up in indiana i mean we can talk about that maybe a little later but but he he's what drew me to this team and it's like and it's the same reason you said it was so interesting to hear you say it is that i just enjoy watching him play basketball more than anybody else in the nba i'm not saying he's the best player i'm not saying that i'm right about it it's just for me what i like to watch in basketball he he's the one i get the most joy watching and and coming to the reality and accepting that a whole year i mean i watch almost all the games you know probably i probably watch too much deborah says i watch too much but i just i'm gonna have to go a whole year and not see him play this really made me sad and then i was able to expand that to fans as well like man it's just it's not just me you know you there are lots of people who really enjoy you know and the city and and him and the teammates and and just you know and then it's also just like the trajectory of the team you know we were we were on the ascend what is this you know just all that stuff and that was all before cards ever really you know came into my mind but at some point you know it's like well what does this mean for me and my collecting and i mean i think the where i think i arrived was that it changes the conditions of the mark marketplace for lack of a better term but doesn't change anything for me right i you know and we maybe talk about that later too but you know the the it got me to ask about the why you know it was a chance for reflection and you know and that just so in the end it didn't really change anything for me and my collecting it just changed the circumstances i was dealing with and just you know the discomfort of of not getting to see him play for for another year yeah the the i think about the buildup and the run and the momentum and i recall because specifically like i think about i'm thinking about during this run was when we saw the sale of the twenty twenty prism rookie black one of one halliburton and there were also some more you know bigger significant sales and cards came out although like you know for the most part at that time i have changed a little bit in my halliburton collecting and expanded into some rookie areas but the stuff that you and i typically like and collect like i don't know i wouldn't say that like overwhelmingly like there was a lot of of those types of cards that came out but i do recall like there are some pieces in my halliburton collection that came out during that time that are cards that like i literally won't get rid of so that happened and then the on the other side of it like after the injury like i don't know it's feels kinda hazy to me at this point but like i'm not quite sure it felt like i couldn't find or see a halliburton card that i wanted for a long time and it's like did people like after this people weren't like i don't think people were like rushing to liquidate some of their key halliburton pieces but i don't know like that's my experience like what were your yeah observations on kind of the the run into then the post injury and kind of what you saw and then like maybe opportunities and things like as a collector you you found yeah man i i think i'm pretty much on the same page with you in terms of you know what i saw i mean i don't you know i don't know every every collector is different and i certainly do you know i i i i do research and i look at data but now like with just kinda my my focus on halliburton and the specific area know like i look at the card letter i looked i pulled up the card letter index for halliburton just kinda doing a little just look see before we talk just kinda looking to see like well what it you know what do what do the numbers say and i don't i don't think there's a non twenty twenty halliburton card in his index on cardladder and there's not a knock on cardladder but it i'm just saying like the data there certainly tells a picture but you know i i don't know i don't know how i am where i fall in the realm of of people who also collect halliburton cards whether or not they're they pc him or whatever so you know i i certainly just come at it from my own vantage point and it's a lot of at this point it's just a lot of kinda gut feel right like mhmm oh kinda here's the here's the price range of what i'll pay for one on ones that are in sort of the the non top tier brands inserts whatever here's kinda what i pay for those golds you know i mean that that's pretty much what i have been collecting just pacers jerseys only and at least in the panini run golds out of ten and then i've i've as inevitably happens i've i've moved into one of ones as well but you know and not nothing really seemed different to me in terms of cards that came out or cards that didn't come out and the and honestly like you know my gut feel is that the pricing kinda all seem to stay the same what what i what i suspect is that you know i mean like so the black one zero one that i have his first year pacers that's you know my my pride and joy of the collection i mean it's the probably the halliburton card that means the most to me but that one i bought off of of someone that i would consider in the flipper category slash dealer who had bought it off of another person in the flipper dealer category and i don't know how many before that right but like you know when tops came out i wanted you know i'm on the lookout of man i just i would love to get this foil fractor one of one tops his first tops caught you know because i have the first pacers prism black one zero one which and then i thought this would be like one of the next logical things for me to to go after but i mean i know i know what the i know what the chances are right i mean it's just like and i i don't have a big network of people to you know hey can you look out for this for me but i i do occasionally get people who send me things but i ended up buying this card off the guy who ripped it right and it was listed on ebay right and you know i'm not checking ebay relentlessly for my saved searches just so that when and i don't know about you but do the do the push notifications actually work for you on ebay like when a new card and this thing gets listed it automatically pops up because i don't i don't see a rhyme or reason to it on my end i'm i'm you might this might make me sound like someone who needs to be locked up but i'm on like dude i'm on like team do not disturb like i i i don't i am so focused in on my work during the day that if i allowed the push notification through dude i wouldn't get any work done so just like a personality type thing so but but again like any free moment i have i'm go i'm going to my i'm typing t y and it's like populating my pin to it and i'm like looking at halliburton cards to see if anything pops so that's usually my method to the madness yeah yeah i mean that you know i just like i said i'm not just checking it all day to see like oh did a one zero one get listed a one you know and i mean just i i don't know the fact that i was able to pick that up from the guy who ripped it off of ebay the most seen platform for you know so i'm at not sure that would have happened if they had been on another run you know to the playoffs and then the the other thing is that i looked at at so if you look at like the basketball index on cardladder right so if you look at that over over the year for the past year it's up forty one percent right halliburton is down eight percent over that time so the fact that i think you know the the fact that i'm still getting that i feel like i'm paying about the same price for cards that i was paying a year or two ago for his cards that i want you know i guess you could see it as a steep discount given how much the market's gone up right mhmm i think you said something there that i wanna highlight that is interesting and i've been on this big kick of like it's not just one market it's many markets and you zoom in and you look at halliburton specifically and it's very it when i think about halliburton cards this is what i think about i think about his rookie cards in twenty twenty and then you've got the the weird year which is like twenty one and with like his second year king stuff and then you transition into his pacer stuff so there's like these three categories and it's like i observe like the pacer stuff because that's what i desire the most and the key pieces are locked away maybe locked away even more now than ever before by collectors because of what how halliburton's like significance to the fan base and then i look at like his rookie stuff and this is the stuff especially when you know they were on this run that was transacting right it's his rookie stuff like he's in his in king's uniform so like feel like halliburton collectors desire that stuff less then i reached this point where it was like well he's hurt this stuff isn't isn't transacting as much and because a lot of the halliburton collectors collect his pacer stuff i'm beginning to see some some opportunities with maybe some one of one rookie stuff so i've been been going in that direction a little bit but like at the end of the day it's like it's halliburton like i love halliburton i'll buy i'll buy his stuff so i just think it's fascinating with a player like halliburton i know we're talking about him going through this injury but he's all it's also interesting because he didn't start his career with the pacers so if everyone wants to talk rookie cards they're they're you're starting with the kings and i just find like the dynamic between those different markets very interesting yeah yeah no it's an excellent point yeah i mean i think i think that's kinda what i what i expected to come out and it sounds like you you kinda have that same sense was that for people who were just sort of speculating on him investing whatever the natural place is to go to the rookie cards right mhmm and that's so i think that's probably why for me when my lane i didn't see a lot of change in what what came out but i i i never i never look at that stuff for his for his i mean occasionally just you know when the big sale happens you know that like that one of one rookie card that's eye popping but you know i think the other thing is that i i feel like i might have gotten it it probably ended up with a a maybe a a more wide open marketplace for me right so like with the foil factor i talked about i felt like okay i probably have less competition for bidding but i think it's only so much of a difference because i'm gonna be bidding against people like you and other people who are pacers halliburton fans and pc him right and it's not i don't know man i don't know what you think about his market but he he doesn't seem like when i go i occasionally go with my buddy to just some local card shows here hardly ever see halliburton cards at these card shows one just popped up in a recent show but it was of course it was a twenty twenty rookie but i just i don't know how many of us there are and who are who are doing what we're doing you know which is which is kinda great you know i mean it's like alright well you know unless it's unless it's in a speculator's hands one of us is gonna get it we're gonna love having it you know so i like that idea of it but yeah yeah the i think one of the things that i wanted to dig into is kinda like this gap year with you and it's like interesting it's like as like i think naturally as collectors we gravitate to like i don't know even if it's more expensive to me it's always been like easier to buy cards like especially when i have that like momentum kick where the player or the team or whatever it is is like performing really well at a championship level i'd say like inversely it feels like until like i wake myself up it felt like a little more difficult during these times of despair to like like try to navigate like i needed some time to like cope and heal but then i find like by buying halliburton cards it actually does help me cope and heal so yeah but yeah i don't know like i find this interesting i love your perspective on this like obviously it's been a gap year we i don't think anyone really wants to like have us analyze the performance of the pacers this season we can talk about them next season but the like have you found with like your collecting has it been easier for you or have you felt more energized or motivated collecting in this year like has it helped fill a void or do you like find yourself was it easier for you to make purchases and decisions when they're on their their run like how do you assess that in this gap year where halliburton's not stepping foot on the court yeah man this is great question brett i i've been thinking about this because for me the the gap year if we want i mean if that's i guess just a good shorthand for it it's highlighted this sort of running conflict that i have had as an active as a collector of an active player which is this i wanna see my player and my team do well right i want them to succeed and if that happens the card prices go up and i'd rather not have to pay as much for the cards right and it is it is there's there's a tension that i think was a little bit that wasn't conscious for me sorry there was a screech here in the background there there was a tension that i wasn't conscious of that sort of the gap year brought out for me you know like wow okay hang on man there is a noise in the background can yeah so you know it highlighted this tension that i have right of just i i want my team to do well and i want my cards to go up but i don't wanna have to pay more for for the cards so that was one that was one dynamic that it brought in it as i mentioned earlier i think the biggest thing that they that it's done for me is that it gave me a chance to just sorta take the emotion out of collecting a little bit right once everything's settled because man how many times have you been watching and then all of a sudden there's just these these incredible finishes incredible game and you're just like i just wanna go buy a card i just wanna go get a card now you know like celebrate so that that that dynamic has not been there at all this year in that way and so you know it really gave me space to say okay why why is it that i am collecting these cards and the cards that i'm collecting and you know it and and reflecting on it it just basically ended up reinforcing everything that i that i thought to be true before this all happened right like i mean i went through well honestly i haven't really allowed myself to think about what if he's not at full strength and that's something we can hit on later i just ref i refuse to entertain that idea why would you we've already been through enough no no no so i i wouldn't i wouldn't go through that exercise but with that out of the equation it's just you know not nothing changes for me he's the person i love watching play basketball the most and i i enjoy him as a person and it's i really enjoy this collection i enjoy the search i enjoy learning more about it learning more about cards i mean and you know i i will do reality checks every once in a while like one of the things i'll do is i'll just check-in on some other players and say okay here are players that i kinda bracket around halliburton what are what are they doing what did this card do for them just to say just to keep a reality check of like have i strayed too far like oh no no i i need to cool off for a little bit or just sort of like oh wow all the i mean actually i don't know that it ever really causes me to buy more because i just pretty much if i see a card i like and i think it's reasonable i i buy it so yeah i don't know man it's that's been part of the process for me i mean what about what about you what what have you found with it you know i'm i'm i'm beginning to from a collector perspective view this year as painful as it's it sounds as a gift from a collector perspective because so much attention is on the players during these moments of you know oh they could be on a run or they're having their best season and so outsiders come in to buy the cards to write try to make a percentage off them and that's just part of the hobby but when a player is out for an entire year like there's none of that happening and so like the competition is if a card is up for auction it's it's usually with other people similar or adjacent to me who are have halliburton collections who just want the cards for their collection but the irony of it is is like there are some great pacers collectors out there and but i i to be honest rodney like i don't know too many like halliburton collectors and specifically like halliburton pacers collectors which seems crazy to me just based on how we both feel about them so i say all that to say it took me a minute where because i would say there's some energy around me when i'm excited when i'm going to the games when the team is winning i'm it makes it easier to like purchase the cards just naturally regardless of the price but it took me a lit like a few months into the season to be like wake up dude like now is your time and so when i had that moment where i understood the landscape and be like nothing changes for me about my appreciation for halliburton and my collecting with halliburton like just because he's out this year it likely means like there's an opportunity to get the cards that i want at a maybe a better price so that's kinda what i've been going through and i'm like when i when i get hit when those signals hit me and i start making purchases it feels like it feels like a tidal wave where i'm like man i should've i should've been trying to be more op opportunistic so for now when i think about my focus it's like man i should i should create more of a like i already have a focus but it should be like a a big focus because like i mean how are you gonna feel next year when you're watching the game or maybe we can get you to come to indy for the pacers' first game when they announce tyrese halliburton i mean i'm getting goosebumps thinking about it so it's like and at that moment i'm just gonna go home and i'm gonna empty the bank account and be like alright time to buy more halliburton so it's like now it's like dude this is like this is an opportunity i'm just gonna like capitalize on it until you know everyone else wakes up so that's kinda how i feel and yeah it's interesting so i looked up you know you know just kinda preparing for this you know it's like as i was reflecting it's like you know i as i as i said i i generally go more on gut than feel than data and it's kinda i i enjoy doing it that way when i formulate my opinion first and then i go and see does the data support this yeah it's a it's a fun way to go about it and may not be the may not be the best strategy i'm not giving financial advice here but but you know so i looked at so we talked about the the index the basketball index on cardladder being up forty one percent alright so cade cunningham this is all in the past year cade is up over a hundred percent right so he was he was what class was he was he twenty twenty one was it twenty two twenty two i can't remember one of one of them yeah he's he's up a hundred percent brunson which was what twenty eight or twenty eighteen he's up forty four percent sga i think he was twenty eighteen too he's up fifty seven percent tyrese maxey up eighty five percent anthony edwards up twenty five percent how did he have any room to go up man that's a that's a whole another that's a whole another that's a whole another podcast kate kate is twenty one twenty two that's his rookie year yeah okay and tatum wanna guess what tatum's at over the last year is he is he up he's even he's even okay he's even halliburton down eight percent jaylen williams nineteen percent ben caro down twenty three percent chet twenty seven percent down luca up twelve percent you know when i look at when i put all those things together you know someone coming off of just this historic historic run and tremendous upside it says to me that it's an opportunity right that's that's what it says to me and you know you see the ebbs and flows i mean the playoff buildup and then the crescendo and here and there but yeah man i mean the numbers support that it is an opportunity for buying and you know to your point about you know it's not one large market it's a amalgamation of of many markets yeah i do feel like alright now i'm i'm just generally up against the other collectors and i don't and i'm not at least people who are gonna be i'm not out just you know bidding against who knows what the motivation is and the thinking is when you're bidding against people who are speculating so i i think i've gotten a lot less of that and i think it took some time for some of the cards to come out right nobody wants to sell right after the injury and i think as the season has gone on like one one thing i looked at you know it it was a like if i looked at his and again you know you're talking twenty twenty cards but like the peak the peak right around the finals was that's where the peak was for halliburton which is unusual mhmm because a lot of times the peak at least from what i've seen the peak comes before the playoffs and then you know maybe there's a little noise but there's not a lot of unless it's somebody new to the scene but mean to me he didn't feel new but anyway he peaked right at the playoffs and then there was there was a kind of a precipitous drop down to like december then it kinda leveled out and then it's been it's been kinda down and sort of level i mean down almost fifty percent from the peak at the playoffs but what i've seen january february march the sales volume has has been spiking here and there right so what that says to me is that k his prices are down but more of his cards are are being let go and you know i did i didn't dig in to see what what segment of the market that was but you know just a little bit of research and just kinda triangulating with what you said i mean i think it's i think it's right i think it's a it's a good time to buy if if you if you believe if you believe or even if you've even if you don't know even if you're like i'm okay with maybe a whole range of outcomes you know i i think you know at least to me i feel like there's a there's some kind of floor support there you know like i maybe maybe if i did decide to to kinda liquidate a a good portion of my collection for whatever reason feel like it's there's only so far that it would drop hopefully you know relative to you know to some i just don't feel like he's he's at the top of the hype cycle right now so i wanna like understand from your perspective where you like hearing you say i have not like got my mind to even consider the fact that he's not gonna return to form i mean you know i i tend to agree with you based on everything i've seen the public nature of halliburton the workout videos everything else is like you know the the optimistic mindset is like he drop him in we're we're we're right back where we were you know obviously there's some risk to it but you know no matter what we say opportunity or not like we're spending hundreds of dollars sometimes thousands of dollars on his cards during this moment where he's not playing and there's uncertainty on the other side of it have you thought about like what what is that like i don't know like that i think this is a story and it says a lot about the profile of individual we we are when it comes to halliburton and our connection with halliburton but like what do you think that says about you as a collector and your association with halliburton because so many people are buying cards because it's a good store of valid value they believe the cards are gonna go up in value but like how what is what do you think this experience has taught you about yourself as a halliburton collector man it's a it's a really good question there are there's so many layers to it for me when when i think about it so there's kind of the risk analysis side right of just okay what do what do i like just my analytical take on him as a player right even though he's a point guard you know athleticism is not at the forefront of what makes him a good basketball player he is not like taris maxey who just blows the doors off anybody he can you know just super fast can get to the you know those things so i think that minimizes the risk a little bit i think about i think about in terms of where is he in the marketplace you know it just it's kinda like in real estate you know you see that you know oh wow the the the las vegas housing market you know all these people and buying speculatively and then boom there's a big crash right like it just hasn't been that amount of hype right so it's just if i'm gonna get burned i'm only gonna get burned so bad and i look at who i'm competing against to to buy these cards and the at the prices i bought them at and a lot of them now are probably people who think about it very similarly to me i mean he's always gonna hold a special place you know for for everyone so i just from a risk analysis standpoint you know just to to just not be stupid about it yes there there's risk in everything we do right i mean you know there's i mean then there's risk in the overall card market you know though you know it's just it's not without that so but i do feel like i'd i you know when you specialize and you have a pc player and you put a lot of your resources into that that's always you know it's more risk than diversifying and so i'm willing to live with the risk that i've put into it i guess is where i am with that and then when i when i look at guess i guess the other thing is is that i'm also seeing him as being someone on the rise right like i mean you know he yes he's he's not out there playing and racking up highlights right now on the court but he's on you know he's talking with the crew of the the amazon prime crew or whatever after and he's on lebron's podcast and i mean the guy is just he's at every game i mean until he got the until he got shingles i mean he's he's traveling with the team he's emotionally involved in the games i mean he i mean it's just the guy is all in and i mean like every time i hear him talk anything anything that happens only reinforces all the things that i kinda believed about him he's a solid dude he's a brilliant basketball mind he's highly motivated and on top of that i think i talked to you about this you know last season was like man i would just i would like to see him get a little more serious about getting in the gym bulking up and and trying to trying to initiate contact and finish and figure out how to draw some fouls i i thought that was the the if there was any kinda glaring weakness in his game i thought that was it and i i recently heard him talking to about you know he's been working with his trainer i think it's drew hamlin and he's like yeah drew i've got i'm in the gym he's like i put on i don't know twenty thirty pounds and you know he's like some of it's cookies but i'm in there and i'm i want to i wanna get where i can finish and and finish through contact and draw contact so you know i mean it's like i said it's a risk but just every everything i know is just like man i'm i'm i'm still all in and and i'm even when he's not playing i'm still getting the joy i'm still getting the joy the joy you know i i couldn't agree more i am very much looking forward to this season being over with and seeing the buildup to the return i i know we've kind of went a little long here but i wanted to get maybe as as we're kinda rounding the corner on this i wanted to get your feedback on like you know we we did i i i asked you to do this episode obviously to talk about halliburton and we've done that and you're if you're listening you've heard two collectors talk about just navigating kind of buying cards of a player who's not playing and what it's been like and i hope everyone who's listening has gotten some value out of that rodney maybe like is there anything just through your experience in dealing with this as a fan and a collector you can share with anyone else out there who is currently dealing with this or inevitably will deal with it like what will you what would you say you've like learned from this experience as a collector and some wisdom that that you can share well i i can just speak to my personal experience and and maybe that's maybe someone will connect with with some part of it but you know one of the big things was that it it provided me a chance to just sort of reflect on why why i collect what i do and i i would say that like and it also kind of the reality check of like how committed am i to this and that one was pretty easy i mean i was i was in deep but you know i think that you know for for someone who's maybe just started collecting someone or considering collecting someone you know anything like that a little bit of time and space i think i would recommend because you know at least what i saw there was there didn't seem to be a lot of rash moves of people just dumping stuff and and it's the worst time to sell anyway right after the bad news so i and i think in general you're gonna have a little bit of time if you're willing to take it to to get some perspective and sort of you know collecting is you know it's a it's a it's an interesting combination of risk management and you know rational decisions you know lot you know thinking through things and also coupled with you know a high degree of emotion and i think just getting some time and space away around it can help you sort of at least figure out what that emotional part is and and maybe make some decisions you know in that space of where you just you know where you're thinking about things a lit with a little more perspective and and a little more understanding and you know and just and there's anytime you can you get an opportunity to just sort of rethink what you're doing and be curious about it and ask yourself questions that you might not when you're kind of on autopilot of collecting i think to your point earlier i think it's a gift you know i mean god i wish the pacers were about to make another finals run i wish i was watching halliburton compete this year but there's so many good things about it i mean you and i were talking before we hit record who knows what kind of draft pick we might get it gave us time to figure out this center situation i like i like what the pacers did there it reinforced the oh hey guess what we really tyrese really is that good and it gave us a chance to sort of sift through and see who who are the young players developing players that have a future here and who who might not be good fits and what what moves can we make and and you know i like that halliburton's not trying to wasn't trying to rush back and get back into the season they i thought that was a great decision too take the time i mean it takes time to come back so i you know as as painful as we have you know as we revisited the moment it's still visceral it still feels real i mean i think we get transported back in time when we really dig into it there's been a lot of pain and suffering but you know from my viewpoint i'm i i you know i've tried to make the best of the situation i think there have been a lot a lot positives to it as as we've kinda discussed throughout a lot of wisdom there i certainly wish they were on another run although my wallet is very thankful that they're not on another run this year so maybe some more card money there there but i you know there's a ton of wisdom that you shared in this episode hopefully rodney the next time we do one of these about halliburton like maybe we'll we'll do it at the beginning of the season and we'll be overjoyed and we'll be talking about how we're we're spending three to four times what we did during this chat on cards just because we're all amped up that's what happens as collectors right oh my god i'm looking forward to the ride brett awesome well hopefully everyone out there can relate i think this was a a fun episode rodney looking forward to doing this again down the road yeah same man great time thanks for having me on