Alright. We have our next cards in hand conversation coming up. Shout out eBay for sponsoring the series, and shout out, obviously, Card Ladder.

We're doing this in the Card Ladder booth, and I am with one of Card Ladder's founders today. And we he actually, roped me into a 10 mile run to start, this day.

So he also treated me to breakfast and treating me to this conversation. Josh, are you feeling sore? Are you feeling excited? What's kind of the emotions going through you right now?

The run was fantastic. I was very excited to see you there. We had a a decent sized group. I thought it was a lot of fun. At the end of the run, I kicked a tree stump pretty good, but we're good.

We're here. We're ready. Yes. We're ready. We also even though we had a big breakfast, we were just talking about we could eat more, but we're gonna maybe just get into it.

We're gonna talk about this card. And I wanted to talk with Josh about card he has, and we'll set the stage for the card. But I think as a Prism guy, this is one of the most important Prism football cards for a variety of reasons.

Before we get into the card itself and the player, Josh, I wanna ask you about, like, you've been in this, like, finite space collecting Prism finites, which I love because it's the stuff I love, and it's always fun when your friends are collecting similar stuff, than you.

But maybe, like, talk about moving from, like, the LeBron zone into the finite zone and, like, some of your observations and what have you kinda, yeah, how much fun you're having.

So I've been doing the LeBron collecting for almost ten years now. And so I know that market really well.

I enjoy a lot of the cards. I've I've honed in on what I enjoy the most, the gold refractors, the exquisite. And I've picked up most of those that I've wanted over the years, and there's still more I'd love to get.

But the price points have just hit a hit a part a part where, like, you know, I'm spending a lot of money to get cards numbered to fifty and ninety nine and twenty five.

And I've always been intrigued by the one of one chase. And for the types of players that I go after for one of ones, I can get them for way cheaper than Lebron's out of 50.

So it's just kind of a, a good stopping point for Lebron to take a break, switch over to one o ones, and, I'm having a lot of fun. So you have in your LeBron collecting, we've had many conversations.

You've talked about how you like with certain cards. I remember the, exquisite RPA and some of the the golds, especially, like, PSA 10 golds. Like, you like this community around it.

Like, you know other people with the card, and you you all can connect on that. In the one of one world, it's kind of an island on your own. Like, what are the differences you would like, do you like that new zone?

Because you you haven't never been a, like, a LeBron one of one collector. Right. What is what how's that treating you? I was talking about that with somebody with somebody today, how I can't have all of the one on ones.

Because there's only one. And so I just you know, it's impossible for me to have all the ones that I want. So it's a nice, test for me to to to figure out how I'm gonna navigate it.

And, I I do have a lot of nice one on ones that I want, but there's still some where it's like either with collectors that are never gonna sell or the I feel like the players are too expensive or whatever the reason.

So it's a nice, challenge for myself to do something new and not get everything and try to pick my spots a bit. Okay. So I wanna we're gonna talk about the subject, and the car well, I guess, let's let's promote the car here.

It's the 2014 Prizm Aaron Donald Black Finite one of one rookie p s a nine. I I wanna talk about so many things, but I wanna talk about, like, Donald first because, like, in your finite collecting, you are very focused on receivers.

You're dabbling into running backs. Obviously, Aaron Donald is an outlier being a defensive lineman. Why did you decide to include Aaron Donald in this finite Yeah. Collection? This was actually the second one I got.

So I started with the Tyrique and then I got the Donald. So I've I've been a Rams fan since the, Greatest Show on Turf Days 99. So I've always loved the Rams, and I always like Kurt Warner and Falk and Tory Holt and those guys.

So I've kinda kept up with them over the years. And when they've had Donald on the team, I just just watching him, like, explode through the line, like, nobody's even there over the years.

And then watching him get the Super Bowl, and he was obviously the leader of that team. I think he's the best defensive player of this era, you know, him and JJ Watt.

But JJ Watt's rookie is not a finite. So, you know, you could maybe consider this to be the best, defensive black finite card. It just kinda felt like this card's insane, and I just wanted it.

And it was kinda like, I'm just gonna buy it and see what happens. So these cards don't come up every day. Maybe, like and we a lot of us monitor marketplaces waiting for cards like this to pop up.

Maybe tell the story of how you got this card. Yes. So 8099 collector had this and a bunch of other insane stuff. A lot of rookie one zero ones, all so a lot of his best cards.

And he started posting them for sale, and he posted this and I just thought, man, that just seems like I don't wanna say it's a good deal because it's expensive, but I just felt like, he's the best defensive player of the era.

It's a black fine at rookie. It just kinda made sense. So I'd been, like, stewing on it for a week or so. And I thought, man, someone's gonna buy this thing.

I'm just that'll be my cue. I'm not supposed to get it. But then when nobody bought it, I was like, dang. Maybe I should just buy this thing. And so I just messaged him and we made the deal pretty quick.

I also bought the 2,014 finest Superfracter rookie from him. But, obviously, I like this one a lot better. Okay. So Aaron Donald, I think of players in this era, and I think of, you know, best players in this era.

And regardless of position, to me, based on his dominance, based on just consistent all pro level, based on having the Super Bowl moment, having the Super Bowl win.

It it like, Aaron Donald checks every box. But he also plays an unsexy position being a defensive lineman.

For me as a football guy, I don't think that matters. I think when I think about this this era looking back in this Prism era, Aaron Donald will certainly be one of the top players in in my mind.

Do you obviously, you own the card. You probably feel the same way. But, like, what's your, like, future outlook on this card and just Aaron Donald in general?

So I do like the defensive lineman guys because it's such a offensive position in in the sense that you're the one that's trying to do the thing to get the quarterback.

Whereas the offensive lineman are there's it's it's not very glorious because you not knowing they exist is when they're the best. Yeah.

Whereas Aaron Donald, you'll see him exist on the field. You know what I mean? So the defensive lineman, I do actually like that position for for sports cards because you just, like, he just jumps off the screen and he's making tackles.

He's he's the one that made the play to win the Super Bowl. He's getting after Joe Burrow, etcetera.

So for for that position, like like you said, it's I think it's, I think it's fine. And he plays, like, a defensive end. You know? He plays the middle, which is less sexy than, Miles Garrett and TJ Watt, the guys on the outside.

But he had just as many sacks as those guys, and he's in the middle, which makes it even harder, obviously. And, I don't know. It doesn't it doesn't bother me at all.

So I think what's interesting about this Donald, which is there's a lot of players I feel like in your collection that mirror this where maybe I don't think anyone really knew Aaron Donald was going to be Aaron Donald, what he turned out to be.

He was the tenth pick. He would be number one on any board Right. If this were they're a redraft. In the card, you know, he's wearing a practitioner.

See how a lot of these players are. But, like, when you look at a card like this, it being a rookie card, do you ever think about does Aaron Donald even know what Aaron Donald is about to do?

Like, does that does that ever enter your mind when you're like because I know you're a big rookie card collector. Yeah.

How do you think about that? I think he knew. He I think he knew. Because actually the I remember the Rams had Robert Quinn on that team, and they had drafted a really high draft pick at defensive tackle the year before, I believe.

I can't remember what player it was. So I remember when they drafted him, I was like, this isn't even a position of need.

They're just drafting this guy because they think he's something. And I think he felt slighted being taken tenth overall. And I just remember rookie year, it was like, holy smokes.

Because he was on Saint Louis when they drafted him. And I just remember, man, this guy's gonna be a stud. Because he he was the only guy I remember where it's just like it's like the center isn't even there.

It's like how did he and he's in my division with the Cardinals too. And I just remember every Cardinals quarterback just being torched. Do you remember Kyler Murray when he tweeted Yeah. When Donald retired?

Like, stuff like that. Yeah. It's like, he was just a freak from the start. I I it's weird, like, you felt this with I felt this with Brady when Brady exited and, like, you're watching football and there's no more Tom Brady on Sunday.

Yeah. When last year, when Donald wasn't there and I turned on the Rams, like, it was so bizarre. It was like, I I couldn't even, like, watch their defense because it just wasn't the same.

And so I don't know. To me, that's like the that tells impact and legacy. And, you know, we're not talking about Aaron Donald right now like we talked about Tom Brady once Brady retired. But do you think, like I don't know.

Do you think history will be on his side from, like, the real football fan, who loves football history? Do you think they're gonna talk about Aaron Donald in the same breath as some of the greatest defensive players of all time?

I think, the thing that's gonna be good for him is that he retired kind of not in his peak, but he retired before it got bad.

Calvin Johnson style. And I think that usually bodes well for guys, in terms of, like, how they're they're remembered. Because a lot of guys, you know, we remember, like, the last few years and it got a little awkward.

But Donald went out, a little bit earlier than maybe he could have. And so, I think and, like, playing ten years and having eight first team all pros, it's just like he doesn't really have any holes in the resume.

Like, there there is there's not a year where you're like, oh, that year was weird or maybe he'll bounce back.

You know, there's no it's just the same every year. So let's talk about the year in the design. Whenever I see a 2014, even non finite, to me, it's always like, man, this Prism year looks and feels a lot different.

And then you throw the Finite on top of it, and it's like there's a grayish tint to it. Yeah. Yeah. It looks and feels different than any other year Finite. Yeah.

Maybe talk about the design and aesthetic of 2014. So, you know, we talk about Finite how in basketball you've got the black and the Finite gives it that, like, extra one of one pop where it's like it's not flat color like the others.

It's got the extra one of one pop. And like you said, it's like so ridiculously shiny that it turns it gray. It's like the rainbow is like making the color lighten up. I'm looking at it now and Josh just has it in his hand.

He's like turning it over and it's like the whole rainbow is like Right. It's mesmerizing. Yeah. The twenty fourteen definitely has the most, like, voluminous shine over the whole surface.

Like, the whole thing is ridiculous. So you, so you you have have this card and it was the second finite you said. Was Tyreke first? Tyreke was first. Because I won that auction. I was like, well, I guess we're doing this.

This this is what I wanna talk about is, like, the solidification. You started with the Tyreke, and then you have the Donald, and it's like, you're not stopping. Like, you're continuing on this path.

Like, how important do you think it is early in a new collection run to get top guys, top cards to start it off to keep you interested so you don't just, like, leave it like we leave so many lanes that we start?

Well, the other side of that is that it's all downhill here.

Yeah. Yeah. Those are my two biggest ones, I think. And maybe the Jamar Chase, but, like, it's been tough to try to match that. But, yeah, it definitely, got me all in immediately and no turning back.

So, I mean, that's the way I like to do it. All or nothing. I don't know. The the I guess, do you feel because you have Aaron I guess, here's a question. Do you have do you think this is Aaron Donald's best card?

Yes. Why do you think it's his best card? He does not have the traditional shield auto. So he doesn't have that fighting against it. His Topps Chrome Superfractor rookie, is that I think it's this like, it's not even like a pro day.

It's like, sorry. What's like the training camp thing in Indianapolis? The t shirt Olympics. Oh, the combine. The combine. Sorry. I think he's in the combine and he's not wearing a helmet.

So, it's just kind of the photo is kind of weird. The design is not my favorite. I've seen the Bowman Superfractor, obviously the finest Superfractor. And, you know, he's in the Panini era.

So I think this being, like, his first Panini black finite, I think I think it's, like, pretty solidified that this, to me, is, like, better than the chrome stuff. Because he only had two years of the chrome stuff.

So I Top stuff. I I got in this, like, friendly debate recently, and I would love your take on it. Because I think you share in my opinion where TY Hilton's Superfractor came to market, his rookie year, autograph.

Great card. But, you know, it was like, this is his best card. And I was like, hold the phone. Maybe it was because I have the black buy dye rookie.

But it's like, I don't know. When you have a rookie card that is in both Topps Chrome and Prism, it's hard for me to, like, not get I'm just such a Prism guy, so I'll always default to the Prism.

But, like, do you have any, like, re like, strong reasons? Like, what's your case for why you think, like, is it the the Prism brand is just the brand of this era and so that's the way it goes? Yeah.

I think it's because his career mostly is in the Panini era. He only had two years of top. So I think that'd be my primary reason. But the design of the 2014 Tufts chrome for his card isn't my favorite, like I said. So I don't know.

These are just, like, biased opinions, I guess. Do do you have a desire and we were talking about a little bit about this earlier, but do you have a desire to because you have his top black finite prism, his top card I'm gonna say it.

It's his top card. Do you have a desire to go chase any of the other finites in his catalog? So this is what I was saying earlier. Like, I can't have all of them. So because of that, I just sort of just see what I whatever I can get.

You know, I'd I'd be happy to add another couple, I guess. But I'm not, like, I'm not gonna, like, rush to get all of them because I there's I'm just not gonna be able to get all of them.

It's like, you know, it's not Christian McCaffrey. I'm not able to I wasn't able to make it happen, so it's, like, a little bit too late.

And because I'm collecting so many players, if I wanna, like, try to get all of the Aaron Donalds, then it's like now I gotta get all of the every guy players.

So I'm kinda happy with, like, a rookie, maybe one of my favorite non rookies, you know, two or three of each player.

That's kinda where I'm at right now. So I wanna know based on him he's connected in your collection based on the finite, especially the finite rookie side.

Do you have a desire to because of Aaron Donald and his influence, have you thought about picking up somebody else on the defensive side to match in, like, what's your process in evaluating that in making that decision?

I'm glad you asked that question. This is the best question.

Yes. I would love to get, like, TJ Watts black finite rookie. Because I now I'm just thinking, like, in the in the ranking tier of, like, value of position, it's, like, obviously quarterback and then it's a huge drop.

I feel like the defensive guys, are quite a bit cheaper than, like, the receivers, where it's like, Aaron Donald is clearly the best defensive player, and Tyreke is, like, maybe, like, top five, and they were pretty similar price.

So it's, like, a little bit you can get a better player for the price of, like, another dip, which is great.

So because of that, I think, man, TJ Watt would be awesome. Miles Garrett, Micah Parsons, guys like that. If those came available at rookie finites, I would I would go for him.

I know. TJ Watt, dude. 2017, the Mahomes year. There's a lot of good. Dude, the the gold the base gold prism of TJ Watt, I think is like one sale in the history on card ladder.

This Like, never sells. This is what I was gonna bring up, is this is what I find in my Colts collecting, is that the defensive studs are buried in team collections.

And and no one wants to get rid of them. And that's I respect it in a way, but I've had the hardest time trying to pry defensive guys away.

And you just never see them. And when I see them available, even if I'm not bidding on them, I get excited because, I don't know, I'm like hashtag collect defense.

I think they're cool. I think with running backs and receivers, I'm willing to take on, like, Zeke Elliott and, like, that tier of guy.

But defense, I I'm just like, it's gotta be, like, defensive player of the year or, like, five time all all pro first team. That's, like, my cutoff.

But yeah. So I want as we're rounding this out, you've you I've always asked you this as a LeBron guy. Like, why don't you collect his Prism stuff? And you're just like, you know, you gotta make some you gotta cut it off at some point.

You've just stuff got crazy price wise, and you're like, it's just you collect his Cleveland stuff, exquisite. Stuff is like $30. 40, $50 each year, and it's like he's got ten years of Prism.

It's like, I can't But this this lane of yours and this Donald card has given you the opportunity to and I don't wanna say it's affordable because it's still expensive, but more affordable than your Lebron's.

Have you what have what has your bit of experience been like jumping into Prism, although not basketball, but football?

And, like, what do you feel what do you think about it? I was never a Prism, Panini hater per se. But when you collect that LeBron era, you you generally just have the sense that, like, Panini's inferior.

But now that I'm in the Panini era, I think it's an incredible I think they've done an incredible job. We talk about this with Chris on the pod a lot, but, like, obviously, I love the black finites, I sell the black one zero ones.

The golds being out of 10 is spectacular to me versus 50. I think they made a great decision. The Prizm brand is like I think the the Prizm brand has a stake in the conversation of, like, one of the best brands of all time.

It's just it's a very strong brand. NT, they have a great they have a great brand in the high end space to compete with something like Exquisite.

I just think they did a really nice job. And so the more that I'm in this space in, like, optical vinyls and I have always liked Galactic, they just got such a great, selection.

You know, there's something for everybody. There's high end, there's low end, there's middle, there's gold, there's good looking stuff, there's shiny, there's autographs.

I just think they've done a great job. And so, like, coming up to the end of this, the licensing, I hate to do the pump of, like, a I was gonna I don't wanna over speculate or whatever, but my my question Yeah.

My final question was, this car like, genuinely, this is one of my favorite cards in your collection because it aligns with how much I think of how much I think of Aaron Donald.

It aligns with how much I love Prism. It aligns with the black finite twenty fourteen being here. It has literally checks all the boxes for me.

And it's easy when you have the card to say, oh, like, Panini's going away. Like, this card's gonna only continue to go up. But, like, I genuinely, like, want your opinion on we're in an era where the manufacturer's changing.

These cards are gonna probably become less available. Like, what's your you you you're you're very intentional with what you buy. Obviously, it's what you like and what you collect.

But, obviously, there's, like, you're spending a lot of money on this. So you made a decision to buy this card. Like, what do you think, like, the future outlook is for just, like, the Prizm brand as we head into the future?

Yeah. I'm a I mean, I'm not I'm obviously not the only one that thinks, this is probably a a good time to, like, snatch up these, these Panini era cards before it's too late kind of kind of feeling.

And I you know, it's it's not that always kinda comes across as, like a pump or whatever, but, I mean, the license is ending and people are gonna move on to Fanatics and Topps and they're gonna start talking about super fractors and they're gonna stop making Panini card prism cards.

And so there's a limited supply of these and if I can get as many black finites as I can before the era ends and just hopefully keep buying them when we even when we switch over, these cards are just gonna get harder and harder to find.

And, you know, the gold prisms and the black finite prisms, I just think, I think those are gonna be the two parallels we remember from this era.

And if you can snatch up your favorite players of those two, I just don't think you can go wrong.

I just, you know, they're just such great so we're at, like, 2012 to 2025. It's not a small amount of years. You know, Exquisite's a much shorter window, but I think it's small enough, and it's gonna be tough to get these cards.

I'm glad we could get a defensive lineman and his card on this series cards in hand. Josh, incredible card. Thanks for sharing. Thanks, Brett.