it's episode nine yes it is and i am fired up to be here especially after this big weekend lot to talk about today but adam how we doing man i i always start off by saying this week was crazy and i think for the first time in a long time we have a brand new wwe product we have a a really clear picture ish coming into wrestlemania and i think it's gonna be fun it's gonna we're gonna go wall to wall with once we get done with the sort of the the wwe recap we'll go wall to wall with topps universe and talking about our thoughts ryan might even be able to do a live box break if he has the box in hand we can we can maybe rip a box or two and and then we'll we'll close it out but i i like let me let me get into like this this recap here because i think like as we are talking about everything related to wrestlemania we have been for a while i think it's important for us to sort of have a a a good discussion here at least about like what is going on on tv because it really impacts the hobby market quite a bit and you came on this podcast for multiple weeks and you said your pick for the men's elimination chamber was randy orton we have audio and visual evidence of that pick and you should feel very proud i mean i also predicted to win the royal rumble too so at least they got one part right so yeah you got one part right exactly so when you're watching this you're did you have your party did you have your elimination team or actually we had a good amount of people there between adults and kids we had a playing out actually on three tvs i had the outdoor tv in my patio i had the one in our kitchen area i hang out and then one in our living room so i was at the point of this match i'm in the living room watching with you know a group of i don't know eight people or so women are in the other room watching at the kitchen or talking or whatever i don't know it's madness in my house when we have people over it's chaos you know but yeah so we had the party it was awesome and i'm surprised i have a voice today because when orton laid that rko on cody rhodes i got up and started screaming i don't know what words came out of my mouth probably some that the kids didn't need to hear and i was like pin that mother you know get him what and i'm like screaming and my one neighbor she's a diehard dodgers fan she cannot watch games with anybody and she pulled me aside she goes i didn't really share that much passion about something she's like i think we're more alike than i ever thought before and i was like i go this is the coolest thing my vikings are ever gonna get me in the super bowl it's orton going on to mania to get number fifteen so yeah i i was over the moon when it happened that's awesome i i think i think we'll we'll we'll let you have your moment for now i don't think it's gonna stay a one on one match i don't either unfortunately i think i i'm just happy cody didn't win like we didn't need to see he didn't win but he's still getting a title shot six days later i mean come on like like obviously that's gonna end in some sort of fuckery i think two's gonna interfere and it's gonna be a fatal four way is probably what's gonna happen probably i know i'm jumping the gun here on the other on the other side of elimination chamber though like i think orton orton is is definitely like a marquee name you can put up on the banner and people will buy tickets i would love to see drew and orton go one on one i think that would be a great match yeah i think it's worthy of a night one main event like i i i'm so like i'm such a mark for one on one matches i hate when they do like three and four way matches because there's always somebody laying on the outside letting the others have their camera time it never looks right i think the only ones that have been done well are the main event triple threat that they did with punk and roman and seth rollins and then the one with ria bianca and io i think like those those were really like some of the only triple threat matches in recent memory that have worked out to a tremendous degree i think the drew mcintyre seamus and gunther one you mentioned also were was pretty good but like i i just i don't like when they bring all these like people in and they can just be like oh yeah you can hit each other with whatever you want and there's there's no real psychology in a lot of these situations but for the sake of orton getting a maybe not having to get pinned and still not taking the title off of drew i'm i'm happy about that i i don't wanna see orton take a pin from drew mcintyre but i also don't wanna see cody rhodes or or anybody win i think drew should continue to be champion i agree i think that's why i'm more frustrated that we're gonna get this match on friday night which is just gonna equal either a triple threat match or a fatal four way if fatu interferes it's just all this is doing now right and listen jacob fatu is awesome like i i have no i mean he's an awesome talent and i think i think having him in this in this role will eventually push him to the main event which is good because i think he we need we need that sort of you know scary dude in the in the title picture and his cards have ever since he came back from whatever dental injury that he had his cards have been jumping which is great to see because i know a lot of people like kevin from new york roadshow loves collecting him and a bunch of people i know collect him because he's such a dynamic character i love he he's got the end yeah absolutely so yeah i mean i remember back it was two years ago wrestlemania forty when becky won the elimination chamber like yep it was it's just it feels good it really feels good when you're when you're collecting the person that is getting the the main push and i like i i can only imagine what that night must have been like for you i mean you gotta realize i'm just going on a one week high one week ago prior i was hanging out with orton showing him my collection excited that i invested and put all this time money and into him and then a week later watching win at chamber now i'm talking about potentially going to mania i wasn't gonna go i think you gotta be there i think i well my wife was actually diving deep into it today so i need to talk to some other people but i think there's a good chance that either her and i go or her i and parker go we don't know yet but i feel like we're not gonna i i got an opportunity to go watch orton get number fifteen and and just to be a mania i've always wanted to go but i really wanna go with my kids but not ideal where i wanna take my kids to vegas and definitely not when they go to saudi next year so when is that gonna be you know so it's like do i just have to get off the pop and now or never and i think we're we might pull the trigger we're we're gonna kinda talk about it more tonight so i think there's a good chance i'm gonna go to mania now have you been to to wrestlemania never never never been wow yeah it's one thing i have not done and i i always wanna experience first time things like that i haven't done with my kids but it's just one of those things where maybe it's not financially affordable if you take a whole family it's expensive you know so definitely changed and i think like that's where i was i was glad to to get that off my list like i i feel like the event itself like going and and sitting through it is just it's not like it's enjoyable to be there and be a part of it but it's not like you're like you don't get to experience the fun of like seeing all the pageantry on tv up close and i think like that's where that's where a lot of this is is lost and i know summerslam is here in minneapolis this this year i found out that the national convention is literally that same weekend so we're gonna have some challenges there but yeah the stadium show experience like summerslam came to minneapolis when jesse the body ventura was a special guest referee for that triple threat match and it's just like i remember that was one of like the biggest shows that i had been to for forever and like it it didn't they didn't come back in for another pay per view until like tlc and something in like twenty nineteen nineteen so i'm i'm interested to see how this all works out but on the women's side speaking of of people that we're associated with and people that we know who collect rhea ripley is the elimination chamber winner for the women not what i expected i mean she's a raw talent she is not on smackdown she's going up against jade cargill now as you know sort of the person to represent smackdown and i i don't i don't know like i i i'm very happy that rhea ripley wins i i was pulling for her or for tiffany stratton but man like i was not expecting rhea ripley who is on monday night raw to be the person they choose but man she is like like she's a top star in the company i i don't think like there's many that will equal what the the level of fandom that that she has maybe roman reigns when he shows up once a month but like rhea ripley is is the wwe right now and i think they're they're ready to put the belt back on her yeah and congrats steve i know that was big you got to see your girl win with your wife your you know in attendance but he was on tv twice i know i'm pretty sure i predict said this when we were talking and i said there's a good chance i could see them dropping the belts and ria going on to win now i did interesting pick tiffy but i'm pretty sure we rebuttal talked about this and i said i think ria is the one that fits the best mold right now i think that's where the direction they wanna go i really wonder a lot had to do with bianca's injury that they had a really a storyline built up there but rhea needs needs to be in that moment she is the one of the best wrestlers in the world with the female role sorry your your girl becky is was at one point rhea's around now so no i mean like listen becky is is forty years old at this point yeah exactly i think rhea is twenty nine and and entering the prime of her career there was a graphic that showed like she she's been challenging for a belt in the past seven wrestlemanias like you know the thing is all the people online are like oh we need fresh people we need this we need i'm like no one wants to see like jade cargill versus keanu james i'm sorry like maybe on a smackdown like right like maybe on a smackdown that's fine but for wrestlemania you need people that are gonna be able to carry the weight of that event and i think if if rhea ripley and who's the royal rumble winner for the women liv you're your favorite liv morgan yeah right sorry so varia and liv are really sort of like the represent representatives of the women's division going out of those matches then randy orton and roman reigns are for the men like those are some of the biggest names in the company for a reason i think the the royal rumble winners are usually the ones for the tops chrome buybacks so like we'll we'll have to see what match who i think they have to win the match for them to be the buyback but i think it's a good chance that liv morgan wins i think there's a good chance that roman reigns wins so when you're opening chrome hopefully sometime around wrestlemania make sure you're saving those cards but yeah i mean like i i thought the pay per view was good i thought it was entertaining i didn't really look at my watch a lot i thought the men's chamber was a little bit slower i thought the women's chamber was more interesting they had a little bit more sort of planned out there and that running power slam through the pod was absolutely insane for raquel rodriguez i've never really sort of thought she was all that interesting she's just kinda been there in judgment day but i thought this chamber match was really one of her sort of crowning moments even though she didn't win men's side i thought it was like great i mean like the finish was really good i think the whole rest of the match like jevon evans thought would do something more than just that frog splash and his cards have been popping off like i think his and trick williams his cards have been you know up a little bit like all the people in that match in the men's side were like really key for people for the hobby market especially coming into universe i'm kinda sad obafemi wasn't in it like i i kinda wanted obafemi to i think they're saving him for something a different moment i don't know if it's gonna be against lesnar or if it's gonna be rounds against lesnar but i think oba they wanna use him at the right moment i think that would you put him in a match like that i feel like unless they all ganged up on him he would be the one to come out victoriously or what he's trying to do right now so i think there's a lot of long term planning with him to beat him yeah yeah exactly and i think that's kind of the point where you do wanna put him in that position so yeah i'm with you i mean we obviously saw la knight give another botch yay yeah yeah mean i i'm gonna give with you yes raquel and kiana i think were the winners of that one kiana showed that she has that superstar ability raquel i think we're building up something bigger for raquel liv at some point down the road so i mean getting raquel to really get that moment and show what she could do was awesome for her you know it just sides of these wrestlers you don't see and how you put them in the main stage where they're getting all eyes on them is huge yeah then we we sort of like have this interlude in the middle with the box we talked about the box before dan hausen pops out of this coffin with a bunch of dancers i am going to shit all over this i i thought this was one of the dumbest things i have seen in a long time and like you know i i a i'm an aew hater i don't like watching aew i don't like the shtick i don't like all this other stuff i know he's a comedy act he's a merchandise seller too yeah he's he's just like he's one of those like you know sort of our truth kind of people but our truth actually makes this entertaining our truth can actually wrestle too yeah our our truth is a great wrestler like not just a good wrestler he is a great wrestler but he's sort of fallen into that comedy role and like there are people like chelsea green and you know others who fill that comedy role and do it well this is just shtick and i don't like it i don't like dan hausen i don't like what he represents in terms of like the the whole like what was the reason for this like why are you doing this at elimination chamber why is he even around like hired a dave he really lot of people booing it obviously i think everybody's just ready for chris jericho so i think it kinda i i don't if you've seen like the gibson stuff you know like from big daddy you spoiled the surprise on me or something and it's dan hausen like you know i mean i i don't i don't really have an opinion on this obviously i he was before aw they brought him on he did sell a lot of merchandise kids are gonna probably like him i mean like it is what it is he's gotta be comedian so if that's what you go in expecting then you know then i think you're fine you keep your expectations you have three hours back down they they made it as bigger than what it should have been yes i think they they drug this on and made this seem like this is gonna be bigger than poof here comes hundred and ten pound danahausen out of a box yeah so i just i don't get it alright let's let's talk about some of the the hobby impact here because i don't think this could have been a better elimination chamber for the hobby itself you have aj lee beating becky lynch obviously not my favorite outcome but i think you can't beat aj lee in chicago and we saw on tops now on tuesday that she's gonna have her first tops autograph cards which is huge so i think like that's a huge moment for them to commemorate on tops now that's gonna sell a ginormous amount of cards these are her for on card probably on card yes yes yeah you said first autograph didn't say on card now then she has come back yeah yes he had her she had her she had autographs the first time around she did yeah she's had several autographs in the first couple times around but yeah but yeah rio wins our listeners yeah rio wins huge huge for cards there obviously i've been trying to pick up her cards for a while and just because i'm a huge fan of rhea ripley like everybody so randy orton obviously is a big deal in in terms of the cards ryan can probably vouch for that and how much he spends but like even something like when you have people like jevon evans and trick williams and the and the others sort of building up their ability to be in a spot where the pressure is on has collectors that probably say oh yeah yeah maybe i i do wanna spend some money on these guys so i think i like do you think there there were there that this was probably the best possible outcome in terms of the cards themselves yeah i think they got a lot of the wrestlers right that could be in there for the most part i think there's a couple of people that could have been versus out not not saying trick and and jevon yes they were both needing to be in this is a great opportunity to get eyes on these young up and comers in the next generation essentially and people that they're working with storylines so i think that for card wise yes i think you could take keanu james cards i'm sure there's an uptick on those now i think raquel who's been grossly undervalued i think is a good buy right now because i think there's gonna be a long term story tell there with her and liv to where she might end up taking the belt one day and then you never know what if you got in and you were paying ten to fifteen bucks for some of her autos she becomes champ they're forty fifty sixty bucks you know i never thought jay uso would get that opportunity raquel is more deserving of it in my opinion but again there's there's a lot to build from this card wise a lot to take from this with the young names in there they didn't throw a naya jackson there thank you thank you that was key you know keep know naya no no if it's naya like we need that young fresh like you guys said and i think you got the right people in there between the men and women's for the younger ones i think logan paul obviously we know was a pivot for bronson reed everything that happened to paul was supposed to be for bronson reed so again that would have been huge for reed logan paul again doesn't really have any cards and tops now so and we already know logan paul's cards are gonna be insanely crazy but i think trick williams still grows the intervalue i think i looked at they had a finest autograph masters or finest something auto i think it's like thirty forty bucks for on guard you know i mean these they're they're affordable if you think these people are long term you gotta prospect them young yes for sure and like i i think like i think collectors are are entering a prospecting mode more more early on in a lot of these in these careers like you see the prices kendall gray is going for in finest you see like some of those names in that are in evolve that they've made cards of like collectors are catching on a little earlier but i think from a trick williams perspective john devon evans perspective like it takes a lot more for a male superstar because of reasons to get over in with the collectors as does for the females like so i think like people are much more willing to prospect the female talent that's young and up and coming than a male one just because i think it takes a lot longer for them to get established in the main event the division is bigger the the rosters are are larger but i think the female divisions are absolutely stacked so they are you're still gonna be you're still gonna be waiting anyways so let's let's move on to universe i i've let let me just start off by saying because i wanna lead off with this universe is not without its problems we're gonna talk about this there's gonna be a lot of positivity here because i think we both really like the set universe is not without its problems but if you are saying i don't like this product because i don't like what topps is doing to wrestling cards or to the hobby that is that is a take that i think is getting awfully tired awfully fast but if you're saying i don't like the designs i don't like the way the cards look that's all subjective i get it so like there are parts of this set that i really don't like either but i think from the perspective of like there are reasons why this set is absolutely awesome there are reasons why this set probably needs a little bit of work in some of the quality issues and things like that we're seeing we're not gonna spend a ton of time addressing the some dinged base cards out of a blaster i'm sorry that's just not entertaining content but i think what we're what we will wanna talk about is just like what do this set means for wrestling collectors knowing that it's been four or five months since we've had a fresh hobby product and for the most part like my experience with it i know your experience with it watching breaks like it's been generally positive right yeah overall i mean i think again if you're gonna nitpick condition you know this is you gotta remember these cards are when we're talking the autographs they're all on cards they're a hard sign so they're being handled by the wrestler or the superstar and then you're adding the game use element i mean let's be honest the the thickness of the relic cards that are now in the autograph relic ones are massive i mean those are probably printing issues to print that thick i mean these things are this thick i mean i know you can't unless you're listening but they're massive you know and again i love it my best terminology or my definition of this product this is like revolution on steroids basically that a few times and i i've been using that over and over i wanna say wanna stamp my name on that right now because i've been using it for certified use it for weeks yeah revolution on steroids you just i did you know and again we're getting everything that revolution did not guarantee an autograph yes there was kabooms one year there was only one year of kabooms and then you got a galactic per case hit now we're getting a twelve box case you're not getting a kaboom but you're getting one of the masked then now forever togethers you're also getting the what do they call it the red white and blue stars or whatever which is equivalent to a galactic you're also doing four less boxes you're getting three hits on average per box some less some more i've had some insane i had one box in our case that was loaded but it made up for the two other hits that again you're getting dual autos you know what mean there's just a lot of great positive things about this and there's not really much for redemptions i've seen cody who else is redemption is it that's it that's it and i i think they they hit this off the ground running they're gonna make this again next year from my understanding yep there's gonna be tweaks to it but you know you're getting hard sign on card okay that's perfect for me you're getting inscriptions on some guys perfect you're getting event use match worn stuff i mean what else can you expect like and it's at a price point that i think is affordable for people to go especially you could pack them out i mean they're ten packs a box you know thirty five forty bucks a pack or whatever it is at your local shops i mean there's there's a lot more behind the scenes stuff with the to really get this stuff it was a challenge for a lot of people there was not a lot allocated out that that's a different story different time but take it for what it is we have not had a release hobby release since october and that is finest love finest but those are five fifty a box now these are in the mid threes right now i think this has a lot to be happy about yeah if this was so the preorder price in this was one one eighty a box if this was a hundred and twenty five dollars a box i i wouldn't be on this podcast i'd still be ripping and i think it's like it's it's so like at a hundred and twenty five dollars a box like this is like pushing the limits of like what a card product could potentially provide so obviously it's not gonna be a hundred and twenty five dollars a box you wouldn't be able to find it anywhere it would be literally every shelf across america will be cleaned up already is that way at three fifty so like imagine it at one twenty five so then the preorder price is one eighty i i bought my one that's all i got before it sold out i thought that was a great price you don't you don't find sports card products even like flagship tops baseball is not a hundred and eighty dollars a box anymore so like i think like when you look at these types of things you wanna buy any box of sports cards across any sport a hundred and eighty is pretty much now the entry point and i think that's awesome now obviously the secondary market and the amount of demand for wrestling cards given the popularity has taken over the supply is far under where it needs to be the demand is far outpacing it so you're having people like blowout and da price it at three fifty three seventy five a box which is really hard to stomach because for a lot of people who just wanna rip one box or two boxes that is not the way to approach universe you're gonna have six to seven duds per case you're gonna have like two autographs that are probably they're on card they're you know twenty five thirty dollar autographs for both autos when you're hit your thick relic card probably going to be probably you know around that as well so i think like there's it's like you're not getting a a a three hundred and fifty dollar value out of it because it wasn't built for that but you're gonna have all of this other stuff where these other four boxes a case or five boxes a case we're gonna have a dual event used autograph relic you're gonna have all this other stuff and it's like the gear in the stuff is worn on shows it looks awesome the cards look great you have the case hits like there's multiple case hits it's not just one you get two case hits per case you get the stars and the stars parallel and you get one of the the actual cards so you need to rip multiple boxes of this and at a hundred and seventy five dollars great hundred and eighty bucks great three hundred and fifty bucks i get why people are like okay that's too expensive but overall man like i i was i i i did a lot and i think it's it's it was fun it was a good time you said it fun i had i had a really good time with it i have a great time watching the breaks but you're gonna have those boxes that are complete and utter duds and at a hundred and eighty bucks you can walk away and not have to like go be depressed in your room in a dark room with with playing some emo music you can actually like have say okay it wasn't like a a a ball breaking sort of rip but at three fifty a box like that's a that's borderline high end right and i think that's where people are are a little bit frustrated yeah but the problem is you know the issue is is that we're not getting fifteen twenty wrestling products a year you know we're there's just not enough to go around on yearly basis there's only so much coming out we know the delays in year one this was long overdue everybody was amped for a product to finally come out but put in perspective would you rather rip this at three thirty five a box or would you rather rip cactus jack at two seventy five a box yeah it's a good point that's the things like that so i have to put my business hat on versus the collector hat here and talk from a business standpoint because i had to go out there on the secondary and pay three three hundred dollars plus to get more of this product to meet the demand of the clientele that we have not just for today not tomorrow but leading up to wrestlemania we know that this product there's just not enough out there there is not i mean that's all there is to it and put adam put it exactly if they were a hundred and seventy five dollar box then there would be a lot more out there and they probably won't be as good of a release product so it it's kind of a catch twenty two you gotta is it damned if you do damned if you don't if it's half the price you're probably not getting the rate of return yield if it's double the price i get it it's just a market swift i mean and and again i have to play both sides of this and it's it's stressful obviously i like to rip it with you i'm with you i wanna rip it one seventy five one eighty a box but it's just not what it is i mean times have changed you know wrestling products have changed the demand's out there the demand's continuously growing there's breakers all over social media ripping this product to shirts right now yeah it's drying up before it can even get a moment to breathe it's just a lot behind the scenes that people aren't putting together and thinking about and it's it it we're seeing a lot of big card surface already because it's getting ripped to shreds but then guess what when those resting breakers are out which a lot of them are already out they need more because demand says they wanna rip more then the market's gonna continue to go up when there's less and less out there so just a little two sided here of way of taking it from adam and myself and myself as a as a business owner and and knowing and buying this stuff on the back end market it's it's not fun but again i believe in a product like this long term and i wanna have a product like this because it packs out well it packs out well and i think that's one thing to consider for hobby shops this is a good wrestling product to back out for the price point yeah exactly and i think like the the understanding here so let let's let's let's look at it from this period like here here's my so i i let's look at this from like good bad and the ugly right or well let's say like what is working and what isn't working for me i think if you are lucky enough to get one of the five or six boxes a case that that have these auto relics in them like they are some of the best cards that i i think topps has made so far i think they offer on card autograph relics to for from two thousand thirteen all the way up through like twenty twenty one i think topps only produced one which was the sting bat relic from from transcendent everything else was sticker so if you had an autograph relic in a topps product prior to two thousand twenty one i believe it was a sticker unless it was that staying back i could be wrong undisputed i'm trying to remember undisputed they're all sticker and undisputed every single one of okay yeah you're right that that i'm absolutely sure about because i ripped undisputed to a point where i i almost got divorced so i think like i think fact of the day no no i'm joking i'm joking she divorced me already so i think the the understanding here is that auto relics with on card didn't start until panini came on board really and and like immaculate impeccable like those products were the only cards until flawless that really had those on card autograph relics so these are still special cards to get on card autograph relics and you factor in the event used gear all of that stuff like that has that just doesn't happen now oh i'm sorry there was another set that had on card autograph relics fully loaded so fully loaded was an on card autograph relic set and it did have event worn stuff those cards i think are some of my favorites that topps produced as well so i'm not gonna slight fully loaded because i think those cards were fun too but like i said they're still special so i think like overall like seeing if you can get one of those cards and and out of your box like i i would i walked away satisfied when that happened from the boxes that i ripped the second thing that worked i think were these case hits like i think the case hits turned out really really well done yes not a huge fan of like the crazy stock patterns like the fireworks and the revolutions type of things yes like those aren't really my thing but i think the the case hits were really really especially the masked ones the masked cards are absolutely awesome and then lastly i think just the fact that a lot of this stuff is like feels fresh like feels like this is a product that tops it's not chrome it's not something they've done before it's a brand new type of thing which to this day i still think you should use your legacy brands and use that but if you're gonna do something like this at least make it similar to what universe is so for me that's that's really what worked well i don't know if you wanna add anything to that feel i mean no i i think you hit on all all counts there i mean again calling it wwe universe i mean we know it's called the wwe universe i mean i think it goes hand in hand that then now then now forever together that's the opening obviously saying you know the masks are awesome like parker hit the bray wyatt and that was the one i was hoping he hit in a break and i shouldn't even have bought him spots because freaking pulls it the first case we do but those the the thickness they use it was just a little thicker stock but the the type of a car material really awesome i'm i'm with you i'm not a fan of a lot of the base inserts i i don't really care like those really don't really resonate well with me some of them are cool some are different the imaging of some of the cards are really awesome from moments and time like orton getting winning money in the bank and miz and just really cool moments they captured as far as that goes and i it's a pretty extensive set so overall i mean i'm a fan all the way through i knew i would be a fan the more i read into this leading up to the release put this in perspective when i say this is revolution on steroids there's only one box out there online i could find for twenty three revolutions four hundred dollar best offer on ebay again do you wanna rip that and hit well here's the here's the chance it's from a case it's one in sixteen boxes you're not even guaranteed an autograph if you get an autograph it's a sticker autograph do you wanna pay four hundred dollars for that or do you wanna buy one of these at three or three fifty and get knowing what you're get i mean again you're chasing a kaboom there who knows what these case hits you're gonna do on time sure there's gonna be a lot more of these readily available than kabooms but who knows i mean i think if you feel the way we feel about them then the market's gonna drive it then now forever together there's a pretty longer list obviously the mask is a very tight knit disc and you're not guarantee it's one or the other per case you're either getting one of those or one of those and i love the mask i'm i'm all in on these damn cars they're obviously he got he's got the howdy showing here luckily stephanie pulled one for parker so we don't have to worry about chasing howdy now so oh that's awesome yeah and one of the thing that i thought was really good with namesake inserts and the rage inserts i think both of those really were cool ideas rage if you've ripped tops baseball and you like the fired up parallels these the rage parallels kind of remind me a little bit of that the namesake ones are the ones with like the logos of the of the people behind the wrestlers which i thought turned out really awesome so i think for for for that what works well i think there's a like the dual autographs i i hate tag team cards where the autographs are up the side but like these i think worked like i think they did a good job designing these i think the relics themselves are a lot more multicolored when you get down into like the twenty fives and the tens mhmm the foil fractures look really cool in hand i got to see one of those from somebody else who was ripping it and like i i think overall like what works far outweighs what didn't work so in terms of what didn't work the the understanding that you're not spreading out the the like there should be a lot of this product out there it doesn't feel like there is this is a giant checklist and i think like i i i don't i don't feel like there's enough value in those other five or six boxes i mean those were really tough to get through i mean you pull adam pierce or you pull you know some rando from nxt a lot of the the people that left the company obviously this was built like a year ago so it sat for a very long time that's a big problem that did not work at all it felt like you were getting cheated and like all of those things like and and adding on like yeah there's issues with the blasters there's issues with some of the print quality like that's gonna happen on these types of foil cards but people like i see people all the time i don't want chrome cards i don't want chrome cards why is everything chrome this is a reason why chrome cards continue to be the collecting standard across the hobby is because you pull them out of a pack and they look pristine even if they may not grade a psa ten they look awesome and i think when you pull out a card like this and it has some of the foil in a in a little bit like removed from the top of the card or something like that it's really easy to tell especially on the thicker ones and i think like that's that's it i also like some of the parallel structures didn't make sense to me like i would have gone with like orange and gold some of them are out of fifty some of them are out of seventy five ninety nine yeah i've noticed that ninety nine like i the parallel structure needs to be more consistent across all tops products i would've i would've changed the stock patterns on those so it's more sort of flat but that's just me that's a personal thing yeah it was hard to it was hard to see a lot of the serial numbers too it really is hard to i mean obviously you're this is new so you you don't know you're looking for them on the front somewhere in the bottom left corner or or right corner somewhere in the middle below it's really figuring out where these are at and sometimes you have to turn them at an angle light so again i think there's things that maybe they go okay we'll we'll make adjustments next year i agree if you put them on the back that really makes it easier to to see so but yeah i mean i i think there's a lot more positive to take from this than negative and and this is not a product maybe outside of the case hits it's not gonna be a big highly gradable type product because of the type of cards but i think those case hit cards they were done with a different stock a different feel so i think those might grade actually out decently so i'm i'm grading parker's bray obviously when howdy comes in we'll grade that and then i think i hit an orton and a break so i'll probably grade all those but outside of that i'm not i don't think i'm gonna grade the autograph relics stuff like that i think i'll just leave those as is just because of the conditioning and stuff but again when this is hard on card autographs people are handling them it's touching more hands would take an on card foil yeah it's foil yes exactly so again i'm in on this product i think this is a a good one to fit the need that we've been needing for a while i think it's still it's an easier rip in my opinion at the price point versus finest right now i do love finest but only getting two autos in there and six packs you're getting ten packs three heads it's just they're two different type products it's not a chrome feel and finis had a lot of conditioning issues he had things ten but there was a lot of cards that go ahead with finis that came back sevens then i'm like oh wow how'd i miss that you know must have been john cena on the card or something so so if if tops let we've both heard that tops is making this product again for next year mhmm what what do you think is your number one on your list of things they need to improve next year i mean obviously i think this serial number thing was was a big issue for me because i'm ripping on my family and i'm like turning the angle i think that is something they've gotta address maybe again differentiate the color one that looks like a ninety nine and fifty and one on ones are kinda rendering almost the same i would say along those lines i mean obviously i i'm sure they'll tighten up the conditioning issues next year to being the first year they'll get that figured out but those are kind of the only things i really see to me that just on the surface being early as it is what are your thoughts i would really like to see more differentiation in the way the boxes are formatted the collation in this is an absolute mess yeah i can get that so if you open a box and you pull the packs out of the box and you hold it in your hand you can tell if you got a good box or not because if the if the thick relic is on the top of the packs when you pull it out of the box it's not gonna be a good box if you pull it out and the thick relic is in the middle and there's another thick relic on the bottom you know you got one of the good boxes okay yeah and and other things are like parallels are in different spots in the packs when you got one of the a boxes instead of the b ones like i think like there's gotta be a better collation there's gotta be better sort of like quality across the board in a lot of those areas so i think for me that's that's a really important thing you you you need to feel that surprise and if you pull the packs out of the box like i literally opened one of those boxes and just put the packs in a bag that was taken home from the shop like i knew it was gonna be crap i was like forget it i'm just not even gonna rip this let me go on to next box and when i got home and started ripping it like sure enough that's exactly what happened i would also sort of like find a way to differentiate the cards that need those thick stocks versus the ones that don't like the ladders and the table relics and the chairs awesome awesome cards yes but for everything else if it's just a mat relic like don't use three hundred thirty point stock that would that was just annoying i agree on that front fun out of it took the fun out of it i wanna talk quickly about some of these event worn things and like the inscriptions because this is really the highlight of the product for me i'm a sucker for this so every time we talk about universe is what i'm gonna go back to and i think it's so important for me to sort of see like okay if we're getting if we're getting cards that are featuring event worn relics and you're getting stitching like you're seeing in some of the cards you're getting gear that was worn in significant times like kevin owens saying hey these shorts are from when i wrestled john cena coming up from nxt tiffany stratton's gear is from when she made her smackdown debut correct those are really cool things to call out i think tommaso ciampa and johnny gargano had gear in there from the when they won the titles like charlotte has like sequins coming out of her cards i know brandon pulled one of those at your shop like i think all of those things add such a really cool element to this that you just don't get anywhere else like i can see the colors on la knights cards on bron breakers cards of gear that i like just seeing the colors i know which gear that is and that's really really cool yeah i think this is just the tip of the iceberg what's gonna be coming with tops with what they can do with this type of stuff but i think it's a great way to start it off again look just all what he's showing here if you're not watching in main event just the different coloring and the multicoloring and just how these stand out i mean go look online definitely look up the autograph relics i mean the uso ones are awesome but again i think it's huge to know what tiffy's is from it's big i mean if you know what some of these are to what they're what they're part of should add value i mean it's not just there's you know random word on the night of smackdown this is her debut so i think these will be more collectible the more people find out hey can you tell me where this is from and i think more people are gonna be more spending more money on this type of stuff knowing what they're from and that their match and event use versus just something that's not from any specific item event or whatever yeah i think the inscriptions adding on like we see on the liv morgan one zero one she put watch me on we've had a number from ethan page that have a like really cool inscriptions on them like they're like that is the hallmark of i've said that a number of times on here that's the hallmark of what tops wwe is bringing to this but overall like i just seeing these cards versus and and knowing that they're that you have that connection to an actual event is is really cool mhmm personal rips in terms of this i i you mentioned parker pulled the bray wyatt and like you ripped a bunch i ripped a bunch i think like i said my experience ripping this is from ripping multiple boxes at once i thought the boxes themselves tended to be boom or bust and man i i i wish that there was maybe like eight boxes in the case instead of twelve and then you're you're not spreading the duds out as much but i know they gotta make more products to to you know make the demand sort of be a little bit crazy little less crazy but like you pull the like i pulled the tiffany stratton the card like the gear in the card shimmers in the light it's awesome i pulled you know one of the together cards the case hits the with the rock and mankind rock and sock connection like that was cool but yeah i mean like i pulled a dual autograph of chelsea green and piper niven where it has like a a shirt relic that has her face on it i mean i like you get excited knowing like oh this is really important like the same way i felt ripping immaculate and you pull one of those jumbo relic cards that has like a face logo on it and stuff like that it it brings about a different feeling in about how you feel coming out of those rips versus ones where like okay yeah it's revolution i get a a parallel sticker autograph like it just doesn't feel as cool like chrome you pull those red refractors you pull the super fractures you pull that other stuff you feel different i think the universe really captured that with a lot of the cards here from me at least from a personal perspective how i was ripping the boxes but i ripped quite a bit yeah we did one case obviously and that's what he's showing here and and again the crazy thing was the last box is we hit the mass case hit we also hit the red white and blue star whatever they're calling a case hit same box then we hit a dual autograph relic of diy then i hit the tiffy patch auto a naya jack's patch auto and is that i can't remember the other guy's name i'm drawing a blank so what what do i got here one two three four i got four autograph all relic autos in this last box and i got two case ins in one box so going back to what adam said about the coalition of it yeah that one needs to probably be fixed they came about this now but it it was fun we ripped it with my three kids and my in laws came over and you know each of them got two packs and it was just fun to rip the cards look great they really do for what you get and i think that's what people gotta really take into consideration you know leaving that prom breaker card with the the numbering on some of those inserts actually pop out the ones that are parallels really pop and stand out and just look great overall yeah and from a breaking perspective because i did quite a yeah quite a few case breaks like i think that like watching breakers who know what they're doing with this product is gonna make it better that's always the case that's why we we were talking with stephanie a couple of episodes ago like you you gotta you really gotta find the breakers that that know wwe and know what they're doing because otherwise a product like this is just gonna be brutal to sit through and like i think the other thing is like personally you know when when you know that there's one or two boxes that you're waiting for like it it does take away a little bit from the ripping experience like because you're just waiting for those boxes to hit but i would say like from a universe perspective like if if i had to give this a grade and i had to like look at this or let's give it star ratings because we're doing wrestling like i this is a solid like four star product to me if you take out the event worn gear and replace it with player worn i think it's a three star product so keep in mind my my rating is is probably influenced quite a bit by the quality of the relics but i think like even a three star product where you're releasing it in a spot where it's not a crown jewel of the calendar it's not royalty it's not chrome it's not finest and we're still here talking about it like it's really fun to rip it's really fun to see opened watching those videos like think that's a big w for tops trying to create a new product from scratch and and and having this level of success despite the quality issues i i think that's a w yeah i'm gonna agree with you on this one i am at a four as well as four before you even said anything because of the glaring things that i always am big about is again on card venues you're knocking those out plus then you're giving us oh by the way this is from this person's this match or this debut they're being a little more transparent that with that given the information out there so yeah i'm at a four i mean i'd love to give it a five but i think that again they've gotta fix some things for next year but getting the ground running on a product like this they didn't go back to undisputed they did they did something differently undisputed was pretty plain looking for the most part it was the same thing over and over rinse and repeat product this is something new and fresh i think a lot of people you know when they see something new at first they're like i don't know if i like it or hate it but i think the more this one wears out and gets on you like the x bait product i obviously was not big on that sticker autos just not big on that product this one again i i like it for so many so many reasons from a collecting standpoint and and as a shop owner selling this product standpoint i like this for a lot of reasons and i think the cards looking really good makes the perception to a customer when they rip feel better versus just plain jane looking base cards i think there's just a lot of cool things with this product yeah i think like this was probably a replacement for undisputed i i loved undisputed the first time around i also attribute that to the fact that i didn't know what was possible with wwe i didn't know that there was gonna be a a future where you could get multi signed cards on card you could have on card autographed relics i loved undisputed because it was the only premium product before transcendent that really displayed like hey this is this is the cream of the crop right and like now that i see what's possible i look back at undisputed i'm just like that was absolute garbage compared to a lot of the stuff that panini put out a lot of the stuff that topps has put out even so far because it just doesn't represent the current marketplace of being like we're gonna create an experience for the collector it's literally just one color matte relics one color shirt relics and we don't know where they're from sticker autographs on the autograph relics you have on card autographs in the product don't get me wrong and like those those older sort of tops products are literally just make me feel like it it it had potential to be so much more now that i know what was possible in the moment it was the best now i'm like that that i look back on that i'm like i could not buy that today like that would not meet any of my expectations today because i've seen what is possible with panini i've seen what is possible with topps those were designed products now that are really speaking to like hey we're investing in wwe as much as we are investing in other sports back in twenty nineteen twenty eighteen twenty seventeen definitely not the case it felt like the designs were subpar because they they never really dedicated the level of resources that they are now and yeah we can complain until we're blue in the face that they're not releasing enough products yes that is correct but a year from now when football is launched and everything is launched and everything's ready to go they're gonna be pushing out eight to ten products a year they're already planning to release this exalted sena royalty chrome i mean all of this stuff is gonna come out rapid fire those days of starving for products are gonna be a thing of the past and i think like when we get to that point and we finally have that sort of understanding in mind i think the the the vitriol that the community has for topps not paying attention to the license will go away so i think like that's my take on sort of the undisputed of it i know all the old topps fans like undisputed undisputed undisputed is the best thing ever i i highly disagree i for for the reasons i just stated i think it's not a it's not like i look back on the history and think wow that was a really fun time in my life and the nostalgia takes over but like because i was just getting started in wrestling cards i loved what what that could go out and buy packs of wrestlers i'm seeing on tv have on card autographs but now that i see what's possible and i see just how insane some of these things are gonna be for royalty and things that were for flawless and for immaculate and impeccable undisputed seems lesser than any feedback there just before i move on to our last topic here i wish i was playing a drinking game to how many times i heard you say undisputed there i'd probably be roughly beers deep right now about this time oh i know i know you do it i love that that's why i'm like go go for it man i mean like go go on your tangent i mean i think in undisputed the first year was great it was revolutionary a lot of the guys in there unfortunately had passed away but again it became a a rinse and repeat thing a little tweak of a design there was nothing really changing yeah sure they added the fistographs they added cuts they did some things they did some really good things with it but i get your point like i we've done later year undisputed and i ripped them like good god like ripping it now and you're just like oh my gosh like thank god these were cheaper cheaper at one point because what you gotta pay for now you know but no i i i'm with you man i i think what they're the resources is key i don't think a lot of people put this into consideration this product to build could not been cheap to buy all this stuff to buy all these items to put this in to get the collectors closer take that into consideration really take that in consideration these materials they're buying are not getting they're not giving into them they're spending thousands and thousands and thousands thousands of dollars to give us the collectors closer to the athlete closer to the superstar and into our collection i would rather pay more for something and have it mean something versus something that means absolutely nothing yeah and i like i i don't mean to disparage the old tops era like i did because i i was very harsh on that but i think like when you look at when you look at like the the overall structure of of flawless like let's use flawless as like the quintessential achievement of panini's era like those cards like you put them on a shelf and they stand out like you put those on a shelf and from far away you know those cards are incredible you put a super fracture on a shelf a gold vinyl on a shelf you walk by it looks incredible and i think like these cards look very cool for a different reason but i think when you go back to some of the older products especially some of those later year undisputed products where it's literally just jumbo mat relics and stuff like that it doesn't have the same effect and i think topps is really upping the game there only to make it go to this other level when we see the royalty stuff come out and the the wrestlemania auto relics like all of that stuff brings like a historic nature to the collecting experience which i think is so key we're not even talking about value like we haven't mentioned the the sales prices of any of these cards yet i purposefully skipped that because the the prices are are kinda nuts like they are really selling for a ton of money and like we wanted to talk about this from a collector perspective because i think it's like it's it's really important to have that as you go through your rips and say this is something i'm proud to have in my collection so on to the title match topic here now we're getting into sort of like is this gonna hold up do you think part one what do you see like singles prices right now astronomical of course as expected as expected what do you do you think that those are gonna hold up better than you would expect a product like this or are they gonna are are you seeing as exalted comes out as royalty comes out as chrome comes out like do you think that this is gonna hold up this is gonna be a roller coaster of a product okay let's start with vik here autograph that he's shown right here for just a base on card auto that's not gonna hold up those are gonna go down because she's gonna be all over stuff but let's talk about the title mark set and the mass used autograph stuff and maybe some of the stuff like what the rocks relics from some of these tape you know i think those have long term sustainability to where i think they're gonna be going up here and then they're gonna go down and then they're gonna i think the more educated people get with this product on what these items are actually from we're talking about the event used stuff it has long term hold because of the relevancy of it but when it's just a cut and dry on card auto yes person unfortunately passes away that's one thing but this is again axalta is around the corner everything else around the corner we're gonna get more of akira autos i think all that stuff as long it's just run the mill it's gonna be it's not gonna hold up all the show numbered stuff sure the one on ones we know that but i think the i don't know about the matrelics i don't matrelics have always been around they're nothing to me obviously it's cool to have a mat relic but it's like did that superstar actually wrestle in that mat relic maybe i don't know but something that's from the gear of that wrestler like the ortons i'm all in the rollins i'm all in the becky you're all in the title matches riaz every those are awesome those are gonna hold value those are gonna go up we're watching adam put it flawless starz watches they were not anything the the patches are insane but they're just shirts let's be honest there's nothing worn there's no event worn anything those are bringing insane numbers yes it's flawless we get it it was the way to go out but we're talking patch on card autos of actually event worn stuff think about this so flawless is this and that's nothing to do with anything except the on card auto but this is also on card and actually has a relic that is significant to that wrestler think about it i think i think there's gonna be two theories to this think you're spot on what was that i said austin yeah austin theories there's two austin theories here one of them is exactly what you said i think the the flat autographs for this for exalted i i don't think any of that is really gonna be super valuable long term except for like maybe the one o ones but you know i think royalty is gonna come out it's gonna come out probably at around wrestlemania maybe after maybe it's maybe they delayed until summerslam who knows it doesn't matter once those cards hit and they have the same gear relics that i mean they're they're all event years it's gonna be four figures a box minimum probably like at over time it's gonna be i i would say if you go fast forward three years in the future a box of twenty twenty five royalty is gonna be twenty five to three thousand dollars a box twenty five hundred three thousand a box people are gonna go looking for other opportunities to go find the debut sort of event warrant gear stuff and universe has all that stuff it has the same gear the same stuff it'll be at a cheaper price and i think so like you say it's a roller coaster i think people need to be educated i don't think there's a lot of familiarity with how these things work out i'm obviously telling the story on my twitter and on main event and all these other things but yeah like people don't know that those flawless cards that are that everybody is clamoring for myself included that they're they're not they're just shirts from wwe shop they weren't even worn in some cases so i think like the the cards just look cool as i was saying i think you can get the event worn stuff where you have bron breakker's actual sort of like singlet that he wrestled in or tiffany stratton's debut gear or the latter piece that you know was part of this match or the the announce table cover from wrestlemania forty like is on the rock stuff eventually we're gonna have event worn gear from wrestlemania where john cena won his seventeenth title like those types of things are gonna hold up because they're tied to historic moments so even if they come out with new cards with event worn gear it doesn't matter because the they wwe is about moments there's a company built on moments and these gear relics are tied to those moments and the more that that happens the more that they will sustain the value that they have today popularity wise i think it depends on how much tops really leans into it because i think we all know that this this isn't sustainable like there's just not enough gear that the wrestlers wear that you can make product like this year after year after year in every set like can't make a an event worn gear product in every set because it's just not enough so you're gonna have to include some of the shirts they wear on tv you're gonna have to wear include some of the other stuff mhmm and those that's where i think the the roller coaster happens the gear relics where you can actually see it's part of like their trunks or a jacket or something like that i think those are gonna those are gonna hold up let's talk a little bit about wax price as well because i know this is something that you're keenly aware of right now we were talking earlier in the in the podcast about it's about three fifty three seventy five a box there should be a lot of this out there there's not so what do you what's your expectation long term on the wax price here especially if there continues to be supply issues with the boxes yeah i i really think this product's gonna continue to go up and i think it's gonna eventually price some people out obviously we know that until we get exalted in other products breakers are gonna be itching to rip more of this right now which is again cases are in high demand we're trying to suck up as much as we can right now but we're not selling cases we're holding them we're trying to limit boxes out the door because we know that whatever we pay today a week from now two weeks from now chances are we're paying a little bit more most shops probably only got a case or two at most if they're direct with tops again i'm just going off of what i'm assuming and there was no wave two from from all you that don't understand that but i mean that's something i can't go much into detail but this was not readily available to us this is a challenge to get and we do out do a lot with w to b so we're able to get a little bit more but trust me we didn't get a lot and we had to go out there and fight for it buy more go on there go on tops' website try to get it as well you know pay three hundred plus i mean i'm watching on the back end and i just see this product right here and i go this will be four to four fifty within the month we are on the road to wrestlemania which means everything wrestling's going up right now even if we get exalted exalt is a different type of break it's not the same as this it's not a pack out product there are two different types of product tops chrome's a pack out product that'll be different but what do we do are we gonna have that out of mania we don't know right now you know so i think this product right here is one that has a lot of upside potential granted yes we'd all love to buy this product at a hundred and seventy five one fifty two hundred dollars a box but it's just not in the world we live in you know there's just too much demand for what they can produce and adam alluded to it these these relic event worn stuff these true to what they are are not cheap to buy a and they're drying they're gonna dry up they can't sustain to build this type of stuff so i think this product is gonna be kind of revolutionary in a way for what it did and what it's gonna do i mean this is one that who knows but i don't they're not gonna go down i could tell you that what the market is right now it's not gonna go down i can just watch the back end i study product more than a lot of people realize and i study wrestling card products wrestling boxes and this has just not helped their folks like finding cases of this right now under three fifty is like finding a needle in a haystack right now yeah i i think i see a like i'm terminally on social media unfortunately i'm just in front of a computer all day and the narrative tends to be generally negative on on prices for anything you put a box out there at sixty bucks there's gonna be somebody out there complaining like but ryan ryan said it best like there's shit like the the demand for wrestling right now is at an all time high and there's gonna be people who say like that's a bad thing topps doesn't make a product like this if there's no demand like like they wouldn't go out and get the gear they wouldn't make the effort with wwe they wouldn't do the things they did if if the if the market was what it was in twenty eighteen and twenty nineteen they just don't so you can say well i can't afford a wrestling box anymore i can't afford this i can't afford that like yes the hobby is more expensive but if you were an early adopter enough that you remember those times your collection has gained a ton of equity in that time frame as well so there's gonna come a time where people are gonna have to make a decision do i want this new stuff or am i happy with what i have collectors and being on the spectrum that we are you know we wanna hoard we wanna get more stuff we wanna add to our pc and we wanna do it at the lowest possible price but we all want our collections to go up and i don't think you can have both things can't have it no so i think like overall like wax is gonna be the the the thing that that most people are gonna drop first they're they're not gonna be able to rip personal boxes anymore it's gonna force you into the breaker ecosystem that's by design right tops has monetized those platforms for a reason and tops wants you to break on those because it gives them a chance to double dip they get money from the breakers to be able to buy the product and they get it again for the fees on the platforms so i mean like it's there's a reason why those things exist but for somebody like me and somebody like ryan who doesn't wanna open a box and pull people we don't collect we can buy into a case break at the price that an a box used to cost so i can so because i only collect becky lynch i collect some roman reigns rhea ripley whatever like if i wanna go buy a rhea ripley slot it's about the same amount as i would have spent in a wrestling box before but i have a whole case of rhea ripley cards that's coming back to me whether or not i hit it's always a gamble same as it was with the wax back in the day i'm not gonna sit here and try and make an argument for people to go buy from breakers that's not the point here but i think from the understanding the ecosystem and understanding the the economics of this will enhance your ability to be successful in this market ryan and i both spend a ton of time looking at data a ton of time looking at data for a reason i'm on card ladder nonstop because i wanna understand like what i'm up against like if people come to me with cards because i've already established myself as a collector i have the money to spend ryan does too but there are other people who don't so finding that edge in the data can mean the difference between getting what you want and not getting what you want or being last in line to get what you want so i think like the wax price is gonna continue to go up royalty is gonna be an insanely expensive product chrome out of the gates is gonna be a giantly expensive product it's gonna be like different going forward because tops will own everything and that's never happened before but beyond that it's just the ecosystem demands that the breakers are a major part of this that's not gonna change and if it does you know there's probably reasons why that's happening none of those reasons are likely very good well said well said man so i think like we all want we all want affordability we all want to be able to break and rip and rip and rip like we used to that's not today's hobby i'm sorry those days are gone and you know it's sad yeah in some cases but i will tell you guys like if you're looking at this from the right perspective and i think having the education that ryan and i do is is unique right because we're we're in the shit like we are in this every day ryan runs a store i run content we we're on this every day i've had more fun in the last probably five or six years collecting than i have in the previous twenty five combined like it's just it's so much more fun when things are up and when things are going well like you you the despair and depression of twenty nineteen was bad man like i remember wrestling cards in that time frame it sucks when everybody is like this smackdown product or this raw product is so bad i don't wanna rip it like i don't wanna go back to those days and how does it make those those investments if the demand isn't there and i think like there's reasons why people are saying well i want forty dollar boxes of heritage again so do i so do i and get get what you asked for go rip some of those now at three hundred two hundred dollars a box and see what they why they were built at forty bucks have fun pulling them at rental auto that's worth ten bucks you know it's they were built differently back then they were built to be that price point yeah exactly so we've hit our rant quota for the for the episode i think i think we we've gone i think we were going on that but yeah think we did some promos here we've cut some promos hopefully people got some some fun entertainment out of it that's what this podcast is supposed to be we're gonna catch some heat in the comments i can already tell but to close this out was universe a successful product yes hundred percent was it was an absolute successful product it was something that was long overdue that we needed a product it came out at the it's unfortunate when it came out how delayed but it came out the right time but i think it fills a need for so many types of collectors right now i think it fills a need of somebody wanting to rip this or join breaks or a collectability because i think honestly these cards over the three ninety nine are gonna be affordable the the parallels are not gonna be crazy expensive but i think the cards look great themselves to where like they're this is a win all around in my opinion i think this product is a win all around for everybody yeah i agree not much more we can say i've already run my run my mouth enough i'm sure people are gonna love me for this but yeah i think i think universe was a was a big success and i think the fact that the the the prices are only gonna go up is a represent because we saw what happened with cactus jack i don't think cactus jack was a successful product i think go ahead no please no and the thing with cactus jack was it was readily available it was out there you could get cactus jack we were getting offered cactus shack everybody in the mother could get cactus shack that's why cactus shack dropped there's just enough of it i have enough sitting in my warehouse right now that i'm ass ended on it i mean i paid three eighty four hundred dollars a box and what's the retail like two seventy five i mean anytime i sell a box that's that's called red for me because a product like that was so overly produced it backfired tremendously yeah we should've got autograph per box we got four autographs a case so it's like people wanna complain about one thing or another it's like what do you want do you want three hits of boxers exactly so again i i don't wanna lose money when i buy stuff i i invest into wrestling cards and wrestling boxes because i believe in it and when i invested in a cactus jack i made not wise decisions but i didn't realize holy crap there's a lot more of this out there when there's a lot more of something it takes a lot longer for it to get ripped to shreds and to be honest with you cactus jack started heating up about two three weeks ago guarantee you right now i couldn't tell you the next time i sell a cactus jack box of the wdb universe out right now yeah and i think like cactus jack at the tippy top of calf the tiffy top of cactus jack i see what you did there yeah i understood that reference that the product is still banging like i mean like there are cards selling for for high four figures low five figures like that rhea ripley card we've we've talked about on a number of podcasts like it's gonna sell for an insane amount of money and i think that that's an unsuccessful product and i think i don't think because it was copy and paste they were kinda short on resources a lot of reasons why it was the way the way it was but it was unsuccessful like people don't like it people like the the rare and desirable stuff as they do for all wrestling products but that wasn't successful this is miles ahead of that it's brand new new design new take new approach new signers all that other stuff and just wait until we get to twenty twenty six you have aj lee first tops now card we know she's gonna have cards blake monroe is already signing cards she's already like they're only going to make this more sort of consumable and more attractive for people so i again like there are tiers of people in this hobby there always are there have been since the nineteen fifties so i mean like you know the the higher end people like ryan and myself who spend a lot of money on this stuff we're we're loving this but if you're if you're a little bit in the the lower tiers where you don't have a big budget you really gotta be conscious like the blasters didn't measure up they rarely ever do and like so i get why you would have a different take than we do we're we're approaching this from our podcast because this is our life this is the way we live it we're we're passionate as you can probably tell from the the rants on this podcast and the promos we've cut but i think like it's it's a reason why we have a different take on this and maybe some others do because they may be looking at this from a different perspective and and that's why we make this content is because we love hearing those takes we love hearing people talk about tops products talk about panini products talk about wrestling because it just brings more attention to the space my goal has always been to raise wrestling cards up and i think this this product is is gonna be controversial just because it's expensive now and like that's that's just the nature of the business we are rage baiters in a lot of ways and like you know the that's the way things go that's what makes this hobby so entertaining so alright should we do do do we have time for a quick box break do you have a box on hand or i can i can literally grab in ten seconds you want me to a box let's grab a box let's rip one box just for for fun ryan ryan is has wanted to do a box of universe on the podcast for a very long time i think we've we've had a a a bit of a delay with the product so when you think about the way that you know he's trying to get a lot of this done it's like well okay we finally get the opportunity to to rip the box and and it's gonna happen now so ryan for those that are not watching along with us on patreon you're gonna have to call out the big hits in each pack i won't hopefully we get hopefully we get a good a good box here just for the sake of of everything we've just talked about but let's let's let's cross your fingers here i just grabbed a random box quick so i don't know so alright so okay the fat one's in the middle oh that's good sign so that i i sound like whatchamacallit lord of the rings yeah lord of the rings the fat one alright so here we go i'm gonna try to go quick here bianca belair parallel my guys star portal of seth freaking rollins bray i mean like i said some of these images the moments they captured wrestlemania moments that's just to me nothing better than obviously a wrestlemania moment so no number to that one so you get ten packs got china insert bret hart some more parallels so nothing numbered so again the thick one's in the middle alright i got that coming up here in a minute here we go rage of the undertaker we got a b fab of do we know what this parallel is it's kinda like an astro i don't if you could see it do we did you figure out what galaxy i think is it called the galaxy parallel i haven't dove see i haven't dove that much in alright my first big relic in the middle watch watch him pull like the the like some crazy one on one here everybody's gonna say it's rigged oh yeah bubble ray dudley matt relic again to adam's point they did not need to make these cards so thick on these just these matt relic ones i think they could've gone significantly smaller alright so the first hit the first hit's bubba ray dudley rigg to one twenty five becky lynch there we go and if you don't have that one it's yours now i'm sure you have ten of them coming from summerslam is that from summerslam yes it's summerslam yeah so that's returned after being pregnant again alright so here we got triple h and two triple h inserts nia jax parallel nothing else there all the hits are in the backpack that's that's that's good that's that's good unless it's one where we got shorted let's see here so we got shawn michaels type parallel it's hard to see at the camera here we got that oh i'm happy about this sixty nine of ninety nine nxt next level sol ruka auto oh nice are awesome these next level cards this card right here just i if you just angle it and turn it it just looks awesome so like a snake skin almost like brain kinda looks like a snake skin i so i pulled that same card out of one of my boxes and it's re like the next level nxt signatures are some of the better ones that they've made they they are i've i've seen those i'm a fan it's a couple of inserts here drew and foreign objects i can think of well ready to rumble is all i think about when i hear foreign objects triple h parallel to one twenty five just like your becky it's like a green parallel star portal here of rhea ripley oh that's an awesome card the star portals really turned out well the star portals that are numbered are really awesome that was the one i got the breaker of i was saying those stand out so i got two packs left i should have one autograph i hope unless i got one of the shorted boxes stone cold steve austin the three ninety nine i love the three ninety nine design yes so is that purple i think is it purple or it looks like yeah it's got the purple and one of the kinda like that texture on it it's really cool yeah so i got sol rooka this auto autograph can't be that good i feel like rooka is definitely the auto of the box let's see if i even get one let's see here no i got one here we go i called it oh cool though legends of bradshaw it's not awful alright legends of bradshaw autograph there and then got a kane inserts universe there bray wyatt for parker yeah so overall that was a box real quick that solruka's gotta be what probably one and a quarter one fifty or whatever probably yeah like she's been selling ever since the royal rumble she's been selling for insane money but like again that's a dud box right so that's one of the the b level boxes and it's still delivering solruka on card out of ninety nine really cool insert great looking card like i said if this was a hundred and seventy five bucks i'd i wouldn't be here recording i'd still be ripping like exactly i i see your point when you when you put it that way because right there i mean at a hundred and seventy five bucks you worst case broke even on your box yeah especially with like the inserts and stuff like that piecing that out you you make you you you made it back but it's built for that it's not built for three hundred and fifty four hundred dollars four fifty which you'll probably be at next week but thanks for doing that that's awesome oh he knows wait you twist my arm to go rip a box of wrestling cards sure i'm in you know i brought on the kit i had neil bring a case over to my house saturday and i completely forgot to rip it with the kids so parker hasn't felt good the couple days but it feels better tonight i think we might rip the case tonight with the family i can't wait by the way shout out to his hands in the biz oh i need them i mean my my hands ain't high i mean getting solruca was like a win for me when it comes to ripping i don't i don't rip a lot by myself my luck sucks that's all there is so but parker parker has enough luck for like five people so i think you're okay my kid my other two are really good too so i don't know they just they must have got it for another mom because i sure they sure something good for me so alright everyone so don't forget to subscribe to the stacking slab patreon group w w w dot patreon dot com slash stacking slabs you can find ryan at rbi cruise seven literally everywhere visit rbi cruise seven dot com he probably have everywhere and you can have we probably have some stuff that's gonna be popping up there just from the different things that he's gotten in lately my website is w w w dot patreon dot com slash main event wrestling cards and you can find me at w w e gellman on instagram or at sc uncensored also wanna give a shout out to steve at sam w w e he has been tracking all of the one on ones from this product and he's been doing such a good job make sure you're following him on twitter you i i retweet a bunch of stuff so if you if you follow me just turn on my retweets you'll be able to see all the stuff i retweet from steve doing such a good job follow his instagram stories too by the way does a good job posting a lot in there shout out to him as well yes yeah for sure and so if you want universe information we're gonna have you covered next week we'll probably have another guest we're gonna work on a few things i know ryan has a vacation coming up so we're gonna have a cohost here join us as well i think there's there's this is gonna be a really fun couple of months and i i really hope you guys will stick around and be with us the whole way so thanks again big hopes see you later